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Line Magnetic 219ia vs Mc225

I am currently changing things up my system. I am looking to purchase a tube amp and have narrowed down quite a bit. I am unsure however, whether it would be more wise to go with a SET design or a push-pull design. The two amps in particular that I have in mind are either a Line Magnetic 210ia or 219ia SET 845/300B amplifier, or a vintage mc225 push pull amp with 7591 tubes of course. I waved the idea of a primaluna around but am pretty set on the two amps I’ve mentioned.. More will be familiar with the mc225 than will be with the line magnetic, but they get stupendous reviews and feedback, placing them as some of the best out there, next to shindo etc., in the tube amp world. The 225 obviously has its cult following as well, and is renowned and said by many to be maybe the best Mac amp of all time. (doesn’t matter)... anyway..

I am predominantly a record listener, but also listen to some digital and CD. My source pieces consist of a VPI Classic 2 turntable with a Soundsmith Zephyr 2 cartridge, an OPPO 105, and a Marantz 7701 preamp/ phono stage.

I have sold my previous speakers, and will be picking up a pair of 60’s vertical cornwalls this week. 102db obviously means that i do not have to consider wattage as a factor at all. I listen at low to moderate levels generally. Even 2 watts will have the cornwalls blaring. At this point the consideration is quality of wattage and current. The current will be responsible on the power to drive the 15" bass drivers in the cornwalls way more so than the wattage. The line magnetic SET amps will have no issues driving my speakers as they have large quality made transformers and move tons of current.

Here is the thing. I listen to jazz, classical cello and bass arco works, etc etc. I like soft rock as well. I also listen to very aggressive forms of rock. Hardcore, metal, thrash/speed metal, power violence, sludge, crust punk, etc etc. Those familiar, know what i mean. I am unsure on whether to go with a SET amp or PUSH PULL. Will one suit me better, or does it not necessarily matter, and either should do just fine? I know that the mc225 is known for being tubey, however natural, tight low end etc. The 219ia is known for being extremely transparent, refined, with a bold tight low end, beautiful 300B midrange, etc. Read Steve Huff’s review of this amp if you are unfamiliar. He calls it just about the best amp he has ever heard..... However will it does for the heavier stuff i listen to? This music is listened to on LP form more than less, and is recorded well and many are analog recordings.

Any input by those familiar with these two amps OR with push pull/SET amp comparisons in their own setups, please chime it with advice. I do appreciate it!

jkull
almarg's avatar
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almarg
9,670 posts
 
[Edit: I composed the following before seeing mb1audio’s post just above].

Hmm. The comments by mb1audio prompted me to find this Stereophile review of the Line Magnetic LM-518ia. (I couldn’t find reviews of any of the other LM amplifiers that included measurements). With respect to that model, at least, a couple of things strike me as being significant concerns if the amp were to be paired with 102 db speakers:

1)The measured signal-to-noise numbers are definitely in the worrisome category, given that 102 db speakers will be used. I note that the reviewer used the amp with a number of different speakers, but I’m pretty certain that none of them are rated higher than 93 db. JA’s comment:
Switching an A-weighting filter into circuit improved these [signal-to-noise] ratios to, respectively, 65.6, 67.4, and 68.8dB, which will be barely adequate with high-sensitivity loudspeakers.... Repeating the spectral analysis with the volume control at its minimum setting didn’t lower the noise floor. This suggests that the noise occurs after the volume control, which means that, unlike other amplifiers, reducing the volume won’t improve the S/N ratio.

2)Another of JA’s comments:
The maximum voltage gain, measured into 8 ohms, varied with the output tap, but was appropriate for an integrated amplifier: 40.2dB (16 ohm tap), 38.6dB (8 ohm tap), and 36.5dB (4 ohm tap).
In most circumstances those numbers are indeed appropriate for an integrated amplifier, but are significantly higher than I would consider to be optimal for use in conjunction with a 102 db speaker. The result may very well be having to use the volume control on the amp, and/or the volume control on any source components that provide a volume control, at undesirably low settings.

Unfortunately detailed specifications or measurements don’t seem to be available for the other LM models that have been mentioned. But given the foregoing the comments by mb1audio raise some very valid concerns IMO. Hopefully reports of user experiences involving the other models and similarly efficient speakers can be found.

Regards,
-- Al


roxy54's avatar
roxy54
8,009 posts
 
I auditioned the Mac 225 with Dahlquist DQ 20s many years ago for a good while and really liked the way it played music, although it certainly wouldn't be considered uncolored. But it was enjoyable and that counts for me.
Just 3 weeks ago, I had a long listen to the LM 219ia on the Devore Oragutans, and I think this is just a superior amplifier. So beautiful, but adaptable to music of all types, an even though it is delicate, it has a great feeling of power in reserve; the feeling that it can handle anything. It is layered, and quiet, and just plain enjoyable. I felt as if the music was coming to life in front of me, and I was forgetting about the amplifier. And this was with the stock tubes.
I stated this before, but I did audition it with the LM 518 on the same day on the same speakers, but to my ears, there was no competition. The 518 sounded course by comparison , and lacking in other areas. If I had not heard the 219, I probably would have though that it was good.
I love the Cornwalls, and I bet that it would be an incredible marriage.
jkull OP
95 posts
 
mbl. I see what you’re saying.. and I can’t dispute you, as it very well may create a lot of noise... I can say, I did listen to a line magnetic 216 loaded with gold lion kt88’s through 104 or 105db la scalas just 2 weeks ago and there was no hiss, hum, or unattractive noise what so ever. We listened to a variety of cd's as well as digital files.  Very detailed and beautiful imaging. It was a nice sound indeed. A local let me come by to hear it actually as I was considering his la scalas but have decided for cornwalls due to the 15" cone vs the folded horn bass.
charles1dad's avatar
charles1dad
10,250 posts
 
Jkull,
Al and mb1 audio raised legitimate caution in regard to gain and sensitivity issues and the possibility of excessive noise. It is reassuring to know that you heard a LM amplifier driving very sensitive (104 db) La Scalas with such a fine listening outcome. The Stereophile measurements cited by Al would raise reasonable doubt regarding compatability. Your direct listening experience seems to have resolved that concern, assuming that the LM amplifiers measure similarly. Nothing beats actually listening to a component/speaker. I believe that you’re headed towards sucess. Your recent experience is consistent with what others have reported when using high sensitivity speakers. 
Charles
mb1audio
151 posts
 
If that's the case, you're doing what you need to do, at least with the amp. The only way you can really tell is to try the components first hand. I would just keep in mind not to be too surprised if your preamp and sources may need to be adjusted. Depending on how they're setup, they may work fine. I can tell you from experience, its just not fun to be blindsided by a problem that you had no idea would even be an issue. Not only do you put a lot of  money into a system, the amount of time and research that goes into all this can be substantial. 
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