Apparently, it's time for "Down and dirtY"; you guys don't even know the time span, or jazz musicians who were influenced by "Bird and Diz". I use the two because they are responsible for what's called "Modern Jazz"; they "can not" be separated; try "Bird Diz" music and influence. Read what Lennie Tristano has to say about this music.
Since Miles couldn't wait to catch up with "Bird and Diz" in 1944, the music they were working on was before then, which means it covers quite a time span. It was a mass movement from swing to "Be-Bop", which slid into "Hard-Bop" and "Modern-Jazz". The ease with which all of this merged into "Modern-Jazz", the catch all for the jazz of a few decades is astounding.
So many of "Your" favorite musicians give "Bird and Diz" credit for their inspiration; I'll let you name them; but when you compare Miles "Revolution" in jazz which was not universally approved, to Diz,n Birds "Mass Movement" to something as broad as "Modern Jazz", you will find that Miles comes up way short when we look at "The Big Picture."
Let us examine what Miles has to say about Dizzy Gillespie.
"The greatest feeling I ever had in my life-with my clothes on-was when I first heard Diz and Bird together in St. Louis, Missouri, back in 1944. I was eighteen years old and had just graduated from Lincoln High School. It was just across the Mississippi River in East. St. Louis."
"As much as I loved Bird back then, if it hadn't been for Dizzy I wouldn't be where I am today." After that, Miles goes on and on with two pages almost exclusively about "Dizzy Gillespie".
"I'd go over to his house, and Lorraine, his wife, wouldn't let nobody stay there too long but me. She would be saying to Diz, "What you doing with all them people in my house! Get them out of here and I mean right now!" So I would get up to leave too, and she'd say, "Not you Miles, but all the rest of them people got to go".
"Dizzy was also very, very beautiful and I loved him, and still do today.
Frogman, when it comes to laying down "Bull=7#^", nobody lays down more of it than you, and you always do it in such a way that pits me against somebody else.
Let me give yall the Frogman; "he is willing to destroy the very forum that he started for sharing and discussing the music that he claims to love so much. And destroy it he will by insulting and alienating those who have a different point of view from his and which all evidence shows is much closer to the truth than his point of view. Better to destroy it than to have to deal with having been mistaken about anything that has to do with his personality calling card..."Aficionado". And, yes, all this bulls#% IS one of the main reasons that there aren’t more contributors to this thread. Not that, as he claims, as yet another example of the need to stroke his ego, it is that there are only a select few that have the "insight" or "knowledge" or open window to the "soul" of jazz; a select few that will be smaller and and smaller in numbers until this thread is no more.
O-10, IT WAS you who started this most recent squabble and proceeded to feed it. You asked a question and then proceeded to insult and demean those who factually and in a good spirited way expressed a different point of view from yours. You then, as is usual, proceeded to create smoke screens around your reasons and justifications for your divisive behavior by making statements about things that have nothing to do with the original questions; and you continue to do so. I could address these point for point, but not only am I tired of this, but its all pretty obvious if you just go back over the exchanges. As far as I am concerned you owe everyone here an apology. As always, all this in the hope that this thread can be better than this.
Frogman, you set this up by pitting everyone else against me, as far as "You are concerned" I owe everyone an apology" Is that a fact?
According to the great "Schubert" Someone needs to start a new jazz forum and leave the jerk to HIS circle .
Anytime there is a squabble, it can be traced back to the Frogman, who always points the finger at me, and then he comes up with the small number of people on this thread which has lasted longer than any other thread on "Audiogon".
Well, I say to you Mr. Frogman, you have my blessings on your new thread.
