2. digital
  3. 130725-3105

How much does DAC ‘Reality’ cost in 2017?




Thru our own efforts, some trial and some errors, copious amounts of dead presidents, and the efforts of those willing to lend their experience and tutelage to us, we have constructed strong, well balanced, highly resolving and quite engaging audio playback systems.


As a routinely insatiable lot, we’ve found analog simply is not enough for us even with the onset of Reel To Reel playback currently reentering the   neighborhood of high end audio.


Well, that and the fact many are better ‘taker outers’ than we are ‘putter backers’ of the discs, , tapes and LPs we own.


So we turn to the Digital landscape and therein we’ve done our due diligence and ripped all of our CD, DVD Audio, and Blue ray content into as high resolution as the software allows. We’ve used error correction. Been meticulous in choosing the file formats we will live with indefinitely. Amassed terra Bytes of data and thoughtfully stored it in a secure redundant fashion.


We’ve found our fad file managing and playback app, and keep seeking out the latest and greatest media managing software.


We are compelled to do so. It’s the law.

We feel the need for speed!


We thirst for convenience. We’re in a hurry! Time is crucial. We just want to kick back and click our way thru our libraries.


As we rapidly click along the avenues of our data banks, we laugh at the prospect of becoming afflicted with Attention Deficit Disorder.

Hah!

We’ve been patiently waiting for digital domains to catch up to analog performance levels and arguably they appear to have done at least that in recent years, and then some.


Currently, DSD, High res files, and streaming HD tunes have become commonplace or at least readily available via downloads and thru services, respectively.


DAC choices abound. No longer are we forced to ransom the first born, or the last born, depending on which is more the problem child or how attractive this prospect may be, to acquire outstanding digital playback...


Do we still find ourselves in need of the $10K, $20K or more DAC and clock arrangements to achieve sonic orgasms?


Is it possible now to plug and play new DACs into our systems for far less and get ‘goose bumps’? Are there readily achievable DAC options now that regularly put our Jaws onto our laps or the closest floor affordably?


Or must we still chase the upper ranges of MSB, EMM, Meitner, and DCS, etc., to finally put this endeavor to bed?


In essence, which DAC (s) in 2017 are undeniably capable of delivering the goods! Presence. Organics. Impact. Transparency. Detail. Resolution and all of it in a sensible well heeled fashion that places the artists in your home, or yourself at the recital venue across all the current digital formats?


What did you buy to solve the digital conversion conundrum?

Or what are you planning to buy to settle the DAC concern?


Lastly, for our dream sequence, what would you buy if you had $5K to $10K (more or less) to drop on digital conversion, not counting cabling?


Oh, yeah, and of course, for posterity, and me, (cause I’m going to need a new DAC) Why that one instead of some other?

…. Undying gratitude.
blindjim
falconquest's avatar
falconquest
1,108 posts
 
The R2R topology seems to be the current version of choice or at least the type everyone is raving about. A friend purchase the MSB along with the transport and the quality of sound is phenomenal. Understanding the design I thought to myself, I can find a way to do this for less money and still achieve sonic nirvana. I read, researched, read more and finally decided on the Kitsune Holo Audio Spring dac. I am waiting for it to arrive as we speak so I cannot yet report on the results of this dac. If it is anything like the articles and comments I have read then I'm sure I will be impressed.

What I like about this unit is that it is affordable, has outstanding performance and allowed me to also acquire the aforementioned Aurender N100H. My sense is there are several dacs on the market that are affordable and offer the kind of performance we seek. I'm sure the Denafrips and Soekris products are just as good. I just happened to have chosen the Holo Audio. I'm sure it won't be long before we read an article or two about the great R2R dac shootout. Stay tuned. 
blindjim OP
3,092 posts
 
Chayro > As with anything in this hobby, everything costs as much as your ears say it costs. If one is deaf, reality costs nothing.

Blindjim > thanks for the extremely interesting perspectives. I will assume this is in the context of HD audio, and whole heartedly agree.

Otherwise, I’d not wish to bare the burden of being deaf as I’m quite able to relate to the added costs any disability weighs on a body. Trust me.

The sole caveat that looms over any exercise in system errection is there is in fact a step, an entry point, or threshold of diminishing returns, and there is where for all intents and purposes, reality rests.

Thereafter such perimeters lay only uneasy dreams of possibly scant degrees of better, and loads of sheer folly for the overwhelming majority of audio enthusiasts who attempt to pursue it further.

That is where reality truly lives. Immediately at the sign post which reads “not much past this point”. Or in plain English, ‘Stuckey’s next exit’. lol


gs5556 > The $2,300 Schiit Yggdrasil said by RH as one of the best three DACs he's ever heard
add it to an Aurender N100H playback system which would compete with anything in a Dubai penthouse

blindjim > Thanks a lot. whoa!cool.
Didn’t RH say as much about a few other DACs too? PSA, Exogal, etc. can’t recall now. Sorry. I’ll definitely look into it in any event. Thanks again.


Lalitk > The market is now flooded with plenty of DAC's under $10K

Blindjim > I sincerely appreciate your thoughtfulness and concerns, however, this is not about my situations or preffs. It is simply about OMG!! Actually OMG ‘reality’. Subjectively of course, as defined by what a particular DAC can deliver. As is EVERTHING posted anywhere about audio or for that matter anything else, apart from perhaps measured parameters, its subjective. Albeit measurements can be taken to task as well.

In this instance, as was posted above, we have on hand an exceptionally well balanced, most adequate resolving system in place already. You did read that part right? It was in the first paragraph or so.

IMHO Sources are not defined by ancillary aspects like rooms, or musical preffs, topology designs in power or even existing speakers in the system. Sources have only one duty. They must provide the signal that everything else down stream will render.

Here, DACs worth having are not one trick ponies and offer several interface and format handling options and are disqualified if said versatility and capabilities beyond PCM is not their fort.

We’ve all had those moments we’ve heard something somewhere that we just can not forget. A sound that haunts us still. Maybe, we’ve managed to acquire a DAC that elevated our system to unexpected heights.

Consequently, this is decidedly about where have you found your DAC epiphany? Or where do you presume it to be found by either model or price given what you have seen and heard in your home or elsewhere?

Hope that delivers sufficient clarity.


bigkidz
3,397 posts
 
Not sure what the real question is here.  Cost of materials?  Depends on the chassis, caps, resistors, DAC chip or R2R, etc.  A good R2R board can run $300.  V- caps add another $300, power supply caps add $150, transformer $150, tubes, no tubes?, chassis up to $1000 or more, so you get the idea.  Happy Listening.
2psyop's avatar
Ag insider logo xs@2x
2psyop
1,632 posts
 
Schiit's marketing strategy is that they will upgrade the dac you buy from them at an attractive (lower) cost than the option of buying a new DAC. I have upgraded my Bifrost to the Uber model, and could step up to the multi-bit for less than $250 I think?
blindjim OP
3,092 posts
 
Bigkidz > Not sure what the real question is here. Cost of materials? Depends on the

Blindjim > try this: How much does DAC Reality cost these days? Or, you could actually read the introduction perhaps.
IOW… which DACs deliver reality and what do they cost? Not looking for a parts list. I Can’t make it simpler than that. Sorry.
Appreciate the interest and efforts. Thanks.


2psyop > Schiit's marketing strategy is that they will upgrade the dac you buy from them at an attractive (lower) cost than the option of buying a new DAC.

Blindjim > now that is striking. An upgrade path that is reasonable is always gonna be a huge plus IMO.
I think too, any DAC that can provide the experience of live music in the confines of one’s stereo rig should count. This is regardless if it can do DSD, upsample, etc.

Having now read thru Stereophile’s and RH’s article on the “Schiit's” DAC, the only concern I came away with is exactly how detailed and resolute is this thing?

A 15 day trial ain’t gonna be long enough given what RH said about letting it run in for 400 hours before he rechecked it for SQ and found it had gone from a cocoon to a butterfly.
RH is a real card carrying detail freak IMO. Another DAC he included in the comparison was the Berkley Ref which he accounted for using SET amps and I assume his Q7s. he has one extremely insightful and incisive system that’s for sure, though if its all about the details and leading edges , which it can well be for some, it could be much too much of a good thing for others.


More to discover