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Loudspeakers have we really made that much progress since the 1930s?

Since I have a slight grasp on the history or loudspeaker design. And what is possible with modern. I do wonder if we have really made that much progress. I have access to some of the most modern transducers and design equipment. I also have  large collection of vintage.  I tend to spend the most time listening to my 1930 Shearer horns. For they do most things a good bit better than even the most advanced loudspeakers available. And I am not the only one to think so I have had a good num of designers retailers etc give them a listen. Sure weak points of the past are audible. These designs were meant to cover frequency ranges at the time. So adding a tweeter moves them up to modern performance. To me the tweeter has shown the most advancement in transducers but not so much the rest. Sure things are smaller but they really do not sound close to the Shearer.  http://www.audioheritage.org/html/profiles/lmco/shearer.htm
128x128johnk
larryi
4,047 posts
 

I am in agreement with most of what Art Dudley says about vintage 1930-60's gear, generally speaking, but, the specific examples he mentioned in the excerpts quoted above, are not what I would be setting out as examples.  The Quad? Yes, a terrific sounding speaker if one can accept its volume limitations, requirement to be seated in a very narrow listening window, low image height, etc.  But the Altec Valencia?  If one is limited in experiencing horns to just such speakers, it is easy to see why someone would say that they hate horn colorations.  As for the 755, that is certainly and "interesting" speaker--very clear, dynamic and exciting, but, it is extremely colored and quite limited to the kind of music that sounds good through it (pop vocals, jazz).  If one insists on a single driver vintage system, the 756 is far better sounding to me, although even rarer and more expensive. 

Given the thread of Art Dudley's articles over the years, I do wonder if he has had that much exposure to some of the real gems of the past, such as the 555 field-coil compression driver on a 15A horn, or Jensen M-10 or M-18 field-coil cone drivers, or Western Electric 713a,b,c or IPC compression drivers, or Yoshimura Labs compression drivers.  There is also the monster Shearer system that the original poster mentioned that is certainly a contender for best of vintage gear.

I read somewhere that Art Dudley is planning to review the Auditorium 23 system, which is a modern system that utilizes Line Magnetic knock-offs of the Western Electric 555 compression driver, 22A horn and 597 tweeter.  That should be quite interesting.  I have not heard this system myself; it looks terrific in pictures.  My only issue is that those I have talked to that have heard the Line Magnetic replicas of the Western Electric field coils say that they sound decent, but, nowhere close to what the real drivers can do.  It would be interesting to see if Art Dudley has, as a personal reference, experience with the real deal, without which, it would be hard to frame his comments in any kind of meaningful context--where does the system stand compared to the original masters?  That is the burning question.

johnk's avatar
johnk OP
1,975 posts
 
I also run systems with combinations of vintage and modern. Running on modern amplification and with modern sources. A upgraded 30-60s design can easily compete with modern efforts and in many cases are the better option.
johnk's avatar
johnk OP
1,975 posts
 
I revive this thread since my findings and feelings on this issue haven't changed and I have noticed a increase in interest in horns more offering horn designs and more media attention. Much of whats offered are re-worked vintage designs some even using old drivers or replicas of such. I see reviewers exploring vintage horns comparing them to modern loudspeaker designs.  So it does seem like we made limited progress and are re exploring the past for design ideas for future horn systems.
salectric
755 posts
 
Yes, this thread is very interesting and well worth reviving.  Since the last posts here, I am now running a 3-way vintage speaker built around a YL Acoustic (Yoshimura Labs) compression driver and horn.  To my ears, it provides a very natural, warm, dynamic sound.

Johnk, I noticed you don't have an AudioGon system page with details of your setup.  Any chance we can twist your arm and get you to post a description and perhaps some photos?
larryi
4,047 posts
 

Sal,

Those are really nice photos of your amazing system.  I find YL drivers and horns to be fantastic sounding--very dynamic, yet totally relaxed and natural sounding.  The drivers with the diaphragms that are duplicates of the WE 555 can, with the right horn, go incredibly low. 

Deja Vu is getting in some G.I.P. drivers that might be interesting.  I am particularly interested in the field coil woofers that are replicas of Jensen/ERPI/WE woofers.  I think they might work well in an open baffle system, although I don't have room for the giant systems I've seen utilizing such drivers in an open baffle.  Perhaps, a G.I.P. 15" field coil woofer with a G.I.P. replica 597 field coil tweeter for a killer 2-way system?

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