Looking for the best moving coil cart that is around $5K used

Elizabeth:  I remember talking to you years ago and am not sure where you went, but glad you're back..  What say you?  I welcome all comments.

Handyman-if your have a top notch digital setup, you would think digital is equal or better than vinyl. Not all vinyl sounds good, actually, if I was to play a Beatles album, it would be the mono version, the stereo versions sucked compared to the mono’s. I have around $15k retail of a vinyl setup and there are times that vinyl sounds better and there are many times that a DSD or especially a new MQA cut would sound better than vinyl. I’m just saying don’t discount a good digital setup. You would have to spend at least $10-$15k on a good vinyl setup to compete with a digital setup costing 1/2 that. IMO

Handymann you are wrong on this account, I am 65 been to at least 20 ZZ Top concerts as well as others and still have a very good ear, just had that all checked out with a professional 4 years ago as I started to build my retirement system. I find the sound much more revealing on a really good table with a cheap cart or budget cart as to a high end cart on a cheap table/arm. I have to say though when you get it all right, wow there is no looking back. My current table is a VPI Prime/outer ring clamp/BDR racing clamp and SDS and set up well, with this combo the differences between things are always very noticeable, I run a ZYX Universe, a Dynavector DRT XV1s, a Mayabies Standard and a Grace F9R rebuilt by soundsmith with great results and the table allows me to enjoy the differences. With this said, if you don't hear a difference I would just keep the Pioneer and enjoy the music as you receive it, there isn't much you can do and that isn't a bad thing it's just a real thing. Good luck and happy listening, I wish you well. Tooblue

tooblue:  I appreciate your response and will experiment with what you have mentioned.  I think I will mount the Urushi to my VPI and hear what happens.  As of now, both the DRT XV1s and the Koetsu sound very similar.   I just posted a thread about a record clamp.  I'm going to start using the clamp all the time.  Maybe that's where I'm going off the rails.  All I want to do is learn and appreciate all the invaluable info I get from all of you.  Thanks for your patience and indulgence.

Handyman-

I want to comment on the speed/DD/strobe thing.

I don't know how much technical knowledge you have about turntables and analog sound playback, but a strobe tells you very, very little.  Its not speed accuracy that we need, it is consistency and absence of noise.

Its the small, maybe tiny, higher frequency changes to rotation speed that create distortion, combined with all sorts of vibrations. Think about this:  the vibrations mix with tiny groove wall ridges. How does your cartridge tell one from another? Answer: it cannot. It reproduces the music plus the vibrations = distortion.  Similarly a small difference from the proper 33 1/3 rpm speed is generally inaudible except to those with perfect pitch.  Since we can tune to any note we like, even with perfect pitch speed accuracy is largely over rated. But CHANGES in speed create wow and flutter.  I doubt your table wows (low frequency changes), but since it is a direct drive, with nothing to absorb the imperfect drive of the AC motor, it WILL flutter.  This creates distortions that are easily audible and generally not harmonically correlated - they are generally multiples of 60 hz.

A suspended table filters out vibrations.  A belt filters out motor vibrations> a heavy latter is a flywheel - used n pretty much everything that demands true speed consistency (not accuracy, consistency - its OK if it is consistently off by 0.1%)

Maybe the Pioneer sounds great. I cannot say.  They may have the worlds quietest motor and the worlds deadest plinth - really, they may.  But your technical argument is worse than weak, its just dead wrong.  Remember - the $5000 cart you are willing to buy still, debate aside, tell the difference between a groove and a vibration from a motor or the room.  Filter them out. And for heavens sake match the cartridge compliance to the tonearm mass, and get VTA right - those are free!

G