2. analog
  3. 137127-1973

Phono stage can minimize tics and pops on vinyl

Recently @atmasphere  made an interesting statement twice on a thread about CD vs. LPs where he posited that one phono stage can minimize the sound of pops and tics over others.  

I recently upgraded from my 25 year old Aragon 47k phono stage to a Luxman E-250.  After sufficient break-in time, which was considerable, as I pulled out my old, though well kept vinyl, it became very clear that I was experiencing this effect with the Luxman.  The pops and tics were still there, but they were much lower in volume relative to the music and thus made all of my vinyl quieter in the sense of surface noise.

Interestingly, the treble was clear and open.  Well recorded jazz cymbals had that burnished brass sound with a natural airy decay.  You can readily tell the wood tipped sticks from the plastic ones!  Good hall sound and open, expansive soundspace!

So...have any of you ever experienced this kind of change, and if so, what might you attribute it to?

Thanks!
128x128hifiman5
terry9
2,354 posts
 
@atmasphere 

Fair enough - agreed, there IS a distinction.
vegasears
1,173 posts
 
When I got back to vinyl I started with prepackaged deal, TT, inexpensive phono stage and cartridge. Pretty easy to get started but not very rewarding. The surface noise almost made me sell the rig and stick with digital. Yet, I hung in there and started the phono stage and TT rotation. I can’t remember how many have run thru my system but maybe 7 devices each. All the TT’s, cartridges and phono stages were well below a grand. Then I purchased a full function pre amp with MM and MC stages that cost over grand used, I don’t believe there was a major reduction in P&C but with better resolution, it was just less noticeable. Getting rid of some of the P&C was long process of finding the right synergy between my cartridge (s) and pre amp.

Side note. My Wife and I listen together, she’s not a vinyl person and hates the P&C. Recently I switched to a Shibata stylus and She has became a believer. So for the last few months we’ve listened to nothing but vinyl. My ears have adapted and I now even enjoy some of my more poppy LP’s and notice the noise less and just enjoy the performance.

Cleaning: I have an old manual Nitty Gritty, carbon fiber brush and microfiber cloths
atmasphere's avatar
atmasphere
11,973 posts
 
'P&C' I'm guessing means 'ticks and pops'...
The stylus might helps as it might track a different portion of the groove that has less noise, but if your vinyl is undamaged the real benefit comes when you use a stable phono section.
hifiman5's avatar
hifiman5 OP
1,832 posts
 
 @atmasphere   Thanks for explaining so much about what is going on with the audibility or lack thereof of Pops and Ticks.  The point you made above about having a stylus that rides in a different portion of the groove is spot on.  My 70's and 80's vinyl was subject to an elliptical stylus.  My current cartridge has a micro ridge stylus which is riding deeper in the grooves.  But, your info. about the phono amp. explains why I am hearing much less surface noise than with the previous phono pre.

It is a very pleasant surprise to rediscover the musical beauty in those older LP's.
soundermn's avatar
soundermn
344 posts
 
@atmasphere yes, thank you for the great explanation!

@hifiman5 yes, I experienced the same phenomenon when I added the Manley Chinook into my rig.  Due to an unfortunate incident, I ended up also changing the cartridge to the AT ART9 with a Line Contact stylus around the same time.  Clicks and pops are virtually gone, even with less than stellar albums.  
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