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Oppo 105 D vs. DAC-transport combination.

To my great dismay, the more I listen, I’m finding my Oppo 105 is outperforming a very well thought of DAC and transport combination for which I paid 3x the price.  Basically the sound stage is wider and better defined.
Both the DAC and transport are less than a year old.  I thought I was upgrading.
Played by itself, the DAC-transport combo sounds great.  Until I compare it to the Oppo. 
I can’t understand it!
128x128rvpiano
Post removed 
mahler123
3,424 posts
 

excellent post, Tim  saved me a lot of trouble as I have been tied up the last couple of days and wanted to make these same points.  Odds are you made them in a more cogent manner than I would have.

   I was so ready to drop lps when CDs came out.  I was just so frustrated at the poor quality of the vinyl, the constant vigilance required to prevent deterioration of the record, and a host of other factors.  15 seconds of CD listening, to Colin Davis conducting Debussy Image For Orchestra, converted me for life.   Even on a 14 bit CDP, which I used for the first 12 years or so of the format until the laser bagged it, had such an expanded dynamic range and such quieter backgrounds that I was hooked.  At the same time my lps were trashed in a house flood, and lps were disapearing from shops in the mid 80s, so the switch was painless.

  Around 2000 used lp stores began springing up.  The one part of vinyl that I really missed was reading the liner notes on lps of classical albums while I shopped.  I began hanging out in the stores for that reason and I began to realize that many of my favorite lps had not bee ndigitalized at that time, and wouldn't it be fun to be able to play them?  I bought the low end Project player of the day and the nreunited with a handful of albums.  Then the vinyl propaganda, sponsored by the likes of Fremer and Dudley began, and I upgraded my vinyl font end, although CDs were still my preferred source.

  3 years ago I began to realize that ll of the lps that hadn't been digitalized around 2000 now were, either in CDs or cD quality downloads and occasionally in high resolution.  Every single time I compared the digital version to one of the lps the digital one, and there was no speed instability, surface noise, static electricity, etc.

  So I sold my vinyl rig, which by now consisted of th Clearaudio Concept mc tt and cartridge, and a Musical Surroundings Phono  Pre Amp.  I had paid about $2500 for the vinyl front end and got about 90% of back, thanks to the vinyl revival.  I used the proceeds to buy a Bluesound Vault2 and node2 and have been very happy.

   I think that for people who have large lp collections, left over from the heyday of the lp, or alternatively have inherited one (as we boomers age, a more frequent event), and who let their lp playback system elapse, it makes sense to want to buy a tt and be able to enjoy the records.  If someone is coming to it from having no physical media at all, I don't understand why they would want to go the vinyl route, but given the pro vinyl propaganda out there, perhaps that is the reason.

rvpiano's avatar
rvpiano OP
2,708 posts
 
“but given the pro vinyl propaganda out there, perhaps that is the reason.”

And perhaps some of us just like the sound of LP’s better.
uberwaltz's avatar
uberwaltz
13,381 posts
 
If anybody bothers to ever look at my virtual system or has followed any of my threads ever then they would know I am NOT a vinyl proponent, or digital or streaming.
I embrace them ALL and recognize that they all have their vices and virtues.
I mix it up between vinyl on my Nottingham Analog /Goldnote PH-10 phono rig, or play a tape on my Nakamichi 582, or play a cd/sacd through my Pioneer Elite DV79AVI, or stream full 24/192 Tidal MQA through my Bluesound vault2/Mytek Brooklyn dac combo.

Easiest way is just not to even bother trying to compare them.
melm
1,085 posts
 
@noble100 

I am indifferent as between good analog and good digital.  I enjoy them both. Most of my listening is to classical.

Dynamic range:  Classical music has the most dynamic range generally.  While the dynamic range of digital is greater than analog, that even of analog surpasses the need in a domestic environment.  In fact, some digital releases have an excess of dynamic range for a home environment.  I can cite many Bis SACD recordings as examples.  So the dynamic range issue is a non-issue IMO

Surface noise. Well cared for records and equipment make this a non-issue and millions of us continue to listen to lps notwithstanding.  We just tune them out, if they'e there, because vinyl gives us a musical experience that the best of digital tries to emulate.

Rumble?  Obviously you have never used a quality turntable.  It is a non-issue though I'm sure some scientist can measure it.  Totally un-hearable on my system.

Speed variation.  Totally a non-issue on a well tuned system.  There is a piano and players in my house and I listen to a lot of piano recordings with notes that trail off into silence (the ultimate test for speed stability).

Channel Separation.  I don't doubt your specs, but as for listening I can discern no difference between the channel separation on vinyl and cd of the exact same recordings. I have many.  It's a non-issue.

Continuous, etc.  I understand the physics so I don't worry about chopped up.  Cartridges can reach well above the 22kHz of a CD as can much electronics.  Loudspeakers, I'm not so sure.

Longevity is another non-issue.  Some of my old records sound as good after years of playing.  It is an old wives tale that they are used up with each play.  Clean and with good equipment it has been written that they are polished by the playing.  I don't know if that is so . . . but they still sound great including those at the top of the pile for many, many years.  Many people report the same.

Some people think that vinyl, with all its issues, sounds more like the real thing, real acoustic music in real space . . and there's nothing you can say that makes any difference.  Vinyl is "better" if it sound more like the real thing, as many serious listeners believe.  In fact, it sounds as though, like so many here, you have never experienced a really good vinyl system in a home environment.  You might be shocked.

As for digital, some of the best, and most consistently outstanding, I have experienced are the SACD transfers of analog originals, the SACDs ripped to hard disk.  There are sound technical reasons why that might be so.  Better than original digital recordings and better even than most other SACDs and other high definition ones.

in fact, and I apologize here for looking at your equipment list, and notwithstanding that you think you've "discovered the true potential of digital," it sounds like you're not experiencing anything like digital is currently capable of if your're still listening through an Oppo 105.  

Cheers.

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