What percentage of audiophiles use a sub ?

I agree with those who are opposed to the addition. IMO, if you are really a two-channel fan then you'll leave the ".1" out of it. Now home theatre? You better have one or at least capable speakers. Otherwise, unnecessary.

On another note, I have to turn my music down most of the time when any really dynamic passage comes because the bass output from my little monitors is enough to shake the entire apartment and I'd rather not have the cops called for that. Now if I owned a house I might turn it up a little more but I still wouldn't dream of adding a sub. I think it also distorts the music a little too. Even a good one. It just doens't belong now matter how you tune it or where you set it up.

But then we come full circle back around to this question. Are you a 2-channel fan? Or aren't you?

If your speakers just aren't impressive or lack bass output of any kind then I can see where one would add a sub. But I think I'd put my money towards upgrading my speakers. Then you don't have to worry about a sub output on your two-channel amp. Which bears another note... I typically don't see many sub outputs on high-end dedicated 2-channel amps, do you? I think they're trying to say something.

A couple of folks have indicated that you should just improve your speakers rather than add subwoofers.

The problem is: The physics of wave propogation at low frequencies (i.e. long wavelengths) suggest that these frequencies will usually remain smoothest (minimized cancellation) when originated at, or near, the wall(s). So, unless your upgraded speakers work best in-wall/onwall/against wall, this "solution" doesn't address the issue.

As to high-end 2 channel products failing to embrace .1 (or.2 or .3), that may indeed tell you something. Just something different than has been implied here. Subwoofers definitely do not hew to the "purist" 2 channel philosophy, but that doesn't mean that the choice of a subwoofer is "wrong". Maybe the philosophy needs to be re-thought.

Marty

PS - You could always forego the sub and smooth the bass region with Digital Room Correction, but I suspect that this is a greater transgression against the 2 channel orthodoxy than even the dreaded "s word".

Most every speaker I know of suffers in imaging, transparency, sound stage and overall clarity when closer to a wall.

Its true that an advantage of a separate sub or two is that the speakers can now be farther away from walls where most everything except bass performance often benefits.

I don't understand any dogma that says subs are inconsistent with two channel stereo reproduction. That makes no sense to me at all.

Tiggerfc : Yes, indeed. Should audiophiles call them "auxillary bass drivers" ?

LOL!!! No no. I wasn't trying to offend anyone or say you can't or that it's wrong. Forgive me for loving my two channels of joy. I just feel that adding a sub approaches the more is less philosophy. And I'm even taking cues from professionally installed with the top of the line products and sound isolation, room treatments....you name it. And I hated hearing the sub. It was so isolated from the rest of the music. I could hear where it was coming from even when it was turned down.

Now on the subject of sound wave propogation. Those very low frequencies will never develop in your listening field. So why bother trying to produce it? I'm not going to start in on the numbers game but if you have a sub and have some specs, do the math. I'm perfectly happy with the bass response out of my monitors. My 43Hz is plenty low. My buddy came over just earlier today for a listen and asked where the sub was at or if there were any other speakers. I told him "yer lookin at it." And the sad part is I only had the volume up 1/6th of the way.

And again, its just another speaker to add more distortion and I don't think the addition of more bass is congruent to the philosophy of resolution and clarity desired by hi-fi audio purists. Then again that is simply an opinion. If you are getting offended then take a deep breath, call me nuts, and move on. ;-)

I really love topics like these. So stimulating.