Stylus Profile Discussion

put a micro-line/micro-ridge on the xl88 cantilever... and then things might be different.

A cartridge is a complex system, and comparisons are difficult.
 
Only single cause analysis can bring any of it out to a point that we can begin to properly ponder.

Thus change the one thing - the stylus profile. And see what happens.

Cleeds, yes in many circles you are correct but it does depend on how you look at the angles. At any rate 92 degrees for most profiles is to close to dead vertical 70 to 75 degrees is more like it. Or 15 to 20 degrees if you look at it the way my old brain does, degrees off vertical. I'm not sure where this 92 degree thing came from perhaps they are measuring to the oncoming facet of the stylus. I'm measuring from the long axis through the tip of the stylus which I think is easier to eyeball when you set the tonearm up. If you put this axis at 92 degrees you'll almost be dragging the tonearm on the edge of the record. But I will have to review the subject to see what modern convention is.

But this may also mean that stylus
shape is not as important as, say, chakster thinks.

From what i've learned the stylus shape is very important for those you listen to vintage vinyl (aka used original vinyl, not a modern reissues or new releases). The majority of the records from the 60's and 70's have been played with conventional styli for decades by previous users (not audiophiles) on average turntables, cartridges. Most likely it was a conical stylus not in the best condition. The groove walls of the records can be slightly worn by the conical when we're buying used old records. But the conical stylus can't go deep in the grooves as Shibata, Stereohedron, MicroRidge, MicroLine, F.Gyger, VdH or Replicant-100. Using high-end profiles like that can dramatically improve the sound as the diamond rides in the groove precisely and in case with vintage used records it rides in previously untouched part of the groove walls! Basically my passion is vinyl from the 70's era, playin' such vinyl with conical or elliptical tip is the worst scenario. 

mijostyn

Cleeds, yes in many circles you are correct but it does depend on how you look at the angles. At any rate 92 degrees for most profiles is to close to dead vertical 70 to 75 degrees is more like it. Or 15 to 20 degrees if you look at it the way my old brain does, degrees off vertical. I’m not sure where this 92 degree thing came from ... If you put this axis at 92 degrees you’ll almost be dragging the tonearm on the edge of the record. But I will have to review the subject to see what modern convention is.

There are long-standing, widely-recognized definitions for Stylus Rake Angle and Vertical Tracking Angle, and those are the definitions companies such as Shure recognized. There is no "modern convention" that has replaced those clear definitions, and I don’t understand why you seek to reinterpret them. I suggest you read the March, 1981 Audio magazine for the article by Jon Risch that graphically explains these angles and explores why they are critical.

From what I have learned from logic is that ''if the premise are not
true'' the deduced statement can't be true. There are to many
assumptions by your deductions dear chakster. If I am well informed
the records (old and new) are not as ''sensitive'' as you assume.
Even 5 g VTF seems to be no problem. There is also ''elasticity'' of
the vinyl involved. If your ''dramatic'' description is true we who
use ''modern styli shapes'' + tonearms with very good bearings 
would throw away all records made before, say, 70is . BTW
nobody assume, to my knowledge, that records are perfect. 
There are then obviously other reasons why we love them.