Seriously considering tube preamp…opinions?


Tube virgin, here. I am building a system and I'm trying to contain the preamp/amp cost to $3k or so. (I could go up a little.) 

I'm inclined not to dive into tubes all the way through, but get a solid state on the output end. (Open to suggestions; inclined toward PS Audio, Parasound.) I'm reading around about tube preamps and have talked with my local dealer, who sells Black Ice/Jolida and Prima Luna (PL). He used to carry Rogue but said they kept coming back for repairs. That's why he carries PL.

I'm asking these questions after having established (via reviews, comments) that Schiit gear is quite the value. Lately, I've been reading about Decware and other small tube makers. I'm very curious about buying direct, if possible, and a company that stands behind their products is crucial.

So, your opinions about tube integrated or *especially* tube preamps —

1. Who do you like? Consider I want to do pre/amp for a total of $3k if possible.

2. Do you think PL is worth all that money just for a preamp? I get the feeling they're high quality but a bit over-hyped. (No disrespect to the highly passionate Kevin Deal, but he's all over my search results.) And what would you think about $2k/$1k preamp-to-amp spending ratio?

3. Any sense of what happened to Jolida since the name change to "Black Ice"? I see there's a sordid story there but did the re-branding clear up the mess? Any experiences with the Black Ice company?

4. I know there are many Schiit fans out there; so my question would be -- did anyone consider Schiit for tube preamp and go another way? Or move beyond Schiit for any particular reason? It's hard not to just capitulate and do a Freya+ or Saga+ but why wouldn't one just go with Schiit?




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@mesch
Using a Jolida Fusion tube pre into a BEL 1001 MK5 SS amp presents a very holographic soundstage in my ~15x12’ room.
Would the right tube amp make an improvement? I can’t say.

I will be receiving a Aric Audio 6sn7 based pre next week to replace the Jolida.

Maybe. However, as you likely well know, your BEL is one of (few, more rare) and exceptional older SS amps that does provide unique sound and soundstage. It would take a really good tube amp to dethrone your amp (an average tube amp won’t cut it IMO), which is higher power of course. With the right 6SN7 preamp and your BEL, you’ll be in bliss. I was in the same boat as you, with a higher power 200w SS amp until I went back to tube monos.

FYI: I ran a similar combo to yours in a prior configuration (tube pre / SS amp), and still have my 6SN7 based preamp. Absolutely love it, and yes, the right preamp will dethrone older Jolidas, handily, unless it has all 5-levels of upgrades which makes it a decent unit - but not as good (IMO) as a super nice 6SN7 based point-to-point preamp. A buddy has one, and the factory modded that Jolida until there was nothing left to do. In my rig I went head-to-head side-by-side comparing for a solid year and finally went back to mono tube amps. Again, your BEL is a bit of an exception. I was messing around with similar demos/approaches with Pass amps, before going back to tube amps. While 6SN7 tube preamps can sound nice, and I like mine a lot spent several years messing around to find really good 6SN7 tubes both NOS and new. I can goof up the sound of my preamp by installing lower-cost and more common new re-issue russian or chinese 6SN7s. Not all 6SN7 tubes are created equal, this is for certain!

This is why you see Mike Sanders (Quicksilver) and others now using (lower cost / more available / quiet) 12AT7 tubes in their preamps. He’s thinking of the consumer, his customers! I ended up with some boutique 6SN7s and it paid off, but it was a journey to get there. When you get your 6SN7 tube preamp, if you don’t buy some new/re-issue tubes, check out the "Sophia Electric Blue Glass 6SN7 Tubes". Not inexpensive, but...can be a game changer IF you do not buy NOS/vintage black plates or something. A buddy has the Sophia Blues and apparently for him they "best some of his very near and dear vintage 6SN7s" he’s tried over many years, and he has a lot of tubes. The key i found in a good 6SN7 preamp is getting the right tubes (with decent coupling caps too) Or, finding the right preamp where the designer truly KNOWS how to build the circuit to best utilize the new/re-issue 6SN7 tubes - very few seem to know how to do it well or at least to make it worth buying a 6SN7 based pre.   

All said, this is what makes the Mike Sanders Quicksilver Linestage (non-remote) version tube preamp a real bargain. He thinks of the consumer, and value.




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Don't overlook building one from a kit. There are plenty of SET preamps kits and plans which are as good as many very expensive manufactured preamps. I made one using Arcturus 27 triodes with blue glass.
Speaking from my own experience I have a Rogue Audio 99 Magnum and have never had any issues ever in almost 15 years. I love the sound of the 6sn7 tube which led me down road of 6sn7 variants, like the 6fg8, and others. Anyway fwiw the 99 sounds great with the right tubes.

Atma-sphere MP-3..you'll simply love it as long as you have low noise tubes to accommodate it.