Short List of Amps I prefer over the Pass Labs XA25 or INT 25

Hi Ralph,

You, @atmasphere ,  make this statement which seems contradictory right after talking about tubes and distortion:

The answer has something to do with the ear's masking principle; that is where a louder sound can mask the presence of a quieter sound.

Right, and this is the basis of MP3 compression, among other things. Why do you think the masking principle benefits tubes??

Best,

E

Right, and this is the basis of MP3 compression, among other things. Why do you think the masking principle benefits tubes??

I thought I had explained that enough, but nutshell explanations can be tricky. Essentially though the tubes have enough 2nd and 3rd harmonic distortion that those harmonics are able to mask the presence of the higher orders. So they **sound** to the human ear as if the higher orders are absent altogether. That is why they sound smoother.

erik_squires;
You seem to have gone off the deep end lately. 
You used to be a reasonably affable and knowledgeable bloke and now this? 
Do you really not comprehend the difference between MP3's shortcomings (and all of digital's) for the totally separate and distinct concept that Ralph is discussing? Are harmonic orders and truncated bits the same thing to your mind? 
To mine, there is one connection between Ralphs's post and digital and that is the limitations of modern measurements. Time and time again John Atkinson would measure a DAC (Benchmark being a prime example) or an amp (Benchmark again is a good example) and declare the measurements to be beyond reproach and often the reviewer coincidentally gave a rave review, but the buying public has disagreed. Certain highly esteemed writers/reviewers at S'Phile even disagreed. That is the only connection between Ralph's point and explanation and digital/MP3. 

And does your post above mean that you have only heard 8 brands of amplifier in your lifetime?
Implicitly equating the performance of ARC and Parasound is another gaffer. 

You used to be a reasonably affable and knowledgeable bloke and now this?

@fsonicsmith

It is clear from your starting sentence you are confusing me with some one else.  I won't be controlled by your disappointment, nor am I obliged to answer all of your obviously malformed inferences.

Do you really not comprehend the difference between MP3's shortcomings (and all of digital's) for the totally separate and distinct concept that Ralph is discussing?

I've never made any such equation.  I mentioned that Ralph was using a concept known to me (please read the entire Wikipedia article here:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sound_masking

)  and to ask him to clarify the leap he made which I could not follow. I did so in a respectful manner, and gave him the opportunity to come back and illustrate his point so I could get it.  Fortunately for me, he did:


@atmashpere

Essentially though the tubes have enough 2nd and 3rd harmonic distortion that those harmonics are able to mask the presence of the higher orders. So they **sound** to the human ear as if the higher orders are absent altogether. That is why they sound smoother.

Oh, my bad. I thought you were saying that the masking some how improved resolution. You are saying that masking reduces the perception of distortion. I was confused because earlier you mentioned that tubes have more detail, but the masking of distortion is unrelated to the perception of detail.

Thank you for the clarification.

Masking though, AFAIK has to do with closely spaced frequencies. Hard to mask higher order distortion, isn't it?

BTW, I like tubes a great deal. :) I'm not attacking them I just want to make sure I understand the arguments.

Best,


E