Esoteric DV-50: Any cdp's Significantly better?


Is there are anyone out there who has compared the Esoteric DV-50 to a number of dedicated red book only players (or other universal's) and found one that is SIGNIFICANTLY better?

I stress significantly because in my humble opinion the redbook playback (if comparison unit is just a cd cd player only )must be significantly better to justify losing DVD-A, SACD and DVD-Video capability.

I keep hearing there are better one box solutions and being a die hard 2 channel fan I would sell my DV-50 if I found a player in the same price range that sounds significantly better. But every time I do an AB comparision to other well respected units the DV-50 has slayed each and every one.

So far, it has eaten the lunch of the Classe CDP-10, Ayre CX-7, Linn Ikemi, Cairn Fog Vers. 2, Cary 306/300, Arcam DV 27A and CD 33T, Myryad CD 600, etc. It even betters a Sony SCD 777ES/MF Tri-Vista 21 transport/dac combo that I previously owned. I'm only comparing the DV-50 to single box cd or universal players, but I just wanted to mention the Sony/MF combo. I'm sure there are some dac/transport combo's that will handily beat the DV 50.

Some may say that the DV 50 should beat all the above because the of price point ($5,500 vs. average price of $3,000 for the above players). But I disagree since conventional wisdom says that stand alone players (especially with the pedigree of those mentioned above) should produce better redbook than a universal player trying to be a jack of all trades. Only the DV 27A does video plus audio. By the way, I was very impressed with the 27A as just a cd player. Of all the above I would say the Ayre was the best.

Next on my list is the Electrocompaniet EMC 1UP and the Resolution Audio Opus 21. However, I must tell you I am really impressed with the DV 50 and all the great reviews are absolutely true. I've noticed that many people who are using it or comparing to other players are using the RCA analog outs instead of the balanced outs. There is a significant improvement in sound if you use the balanced outs and I'm only interested in hearing comments from people who have compared it against other players using the balanced outs on the DV-50.

My system components are as follows:

B&W N803's speakers & HTM-1 center
Cary Cinema 5 (5 x 200) amp
Anthem D1 Statement pre/pro
Esoteric DV 50
Acoustic Zen Satori Shotgun speaker wire
Nirvana SX balanced interconnects from DV-50 to Anthem
Acoustic Zen Matrix reference II interconnects from D1 to Cary
No after market power cords or isolation equipment

My system sounds great! Those who comment please make sure to specify what specific improvements you heard over the DV 50 and what cdp were you comparing it against.

AVGURU
avguru
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In response to Tvad:

Fair question. Here is how I scored the three: Esoteric DV-50 (46); APL 3910 (47); Modwright 9000ES (48) out a "perfect" score of 55. We used a subjective scale of one being worst, and a five being the best, across 11 categories. If I could imagine better or was just a little bit unsatisfied, I didn't score a five. And no, I don't pretend that all of us were in agreement on the scoring categories or exactly what each category referred to.

Before I elaborate, let me say that this was fun even if exhausting. I heard some top-notch CDs, a couple of which I will obtain in future, through some really great equipment. Three players are plenty to compare in a day. I don't see how you could fairly compare more, as your brain needs a break after a while. We did listen to some SACD tracks as well, but none of them especially rocked my world.

To those that say you have to listen to each component in your own system, I have to ask: Do you ignore all reviews? If not, why not? The reviewer's system will never be an exact duplicate of yours and even if it was, your room will be different. Second question: How, if you are not a reviewer, are you going to get three or four or six top-notch universal players into your system for a lengthy test period? Modders don't loan out their equipment to the world at large. I suppose you could buy two at at time, A/B them and then unload one at a loss here on Audigon.

I appreciate Brian's making this audition, or shoot-out, possible. It was worthwhile, even if not as rigorously controlled as some might argue it should have been. And it was just a nice social event after the scorecards were completed. So don't dismiss the idea of a couple of audiophiles getting together to compare gear. Try it. You might find you like it. It might not change your mind, but it is worthwhile.

After a short warm-up period, we picked six tracks and played about two to three minutes, per track, on each player after first listening to each track. That is, cuts 1-6 were played back-to-back on one unit; then the same tracks were played in the same order on the second unit; then on the third unit. At the end, we took a couple of selections and went directly back and forth between players. Brian's sound meter needed batteries so the volume equalization was done by ear and group consensus, and yes I am sure we were a little off.

What each player did right:

The APL Denon 3910 had the clear edge on detail retrieval, bass, and depth of soundstage. On an early cut, from Brian's Nils Lofgren CD, it was a real treat. Steve made no bones about the fact that *bass* is really important to him. I don't see Steve trading his player for one of the other two. I thought, however, the APL 3910 was just a notch below the Modwright 9000ES on vocals - a little dry. And there was something slightly fatiguing to my ears towards the high end in the APL unit. Sorry I can't pin it down better than that, but by a slight margin I preferred the Modwright unit, even though it clearly wasn't the "best" in each category.

The Modwright scored high on overall "musicality" and didn't fall too far in any other category. It's bass could be better, tighter, but it's satisfying. The Modwright wasn't offensive in any category, had a nice soundstage, good midrange, treble, vocals. One other person thought the Modwright was a tad warm. I liked the unit on female voices. I thought there was just a little less detail than on APL 3910, but not much. Very enjoyable, very easy to listen to.

The interesting player, to me, was the Esoteric DV-50. It was neutral, as compared to the other two players, in that it didn't have big plusses or minuses that were easy to identify. It was a solid performer but left me with the sense that it was just a bit damped sounding as compared to the other two units. By that I mean it sounded just a little less "in the room" and vibrant. Tom thought the unit sounded more exciting in his home system, so I don't think I am off in this regard. The Esoteric unit had good rhythm and pace, good bass, and was right behind the other units in the other categories. Bon commented that, compared to stock DV-50 units, Tom's modified unit had a large soundstage that didn't collapse. I would agree.

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In the weeks leading up to this listening session, there was an incredible amount of vitriol expressed in this thread. That's unfortunate. I had never met Bon, Steve, or Tom and his sister before yesterday. They are all into music and very gracious. No one seized control of the event or demanded that everyone vote a certain way. Brian lent some discipline to the exercise, but that's about it. Steve ruffled some feathers coming into this. But after meeting him in person, I don't have any problem with him. I think he's a little like the Rodney Dangerfield of audio in that he is very vocal, and I can see how he could set some up-tight audiophiles on edge. But his APL 3910 is really good and I don't believe that he is into this for anything other than his own enjoyment in the privacy of his home. Steve really likes music and it's not more complicated than that. And the rest of us of enjoyed the music as well!

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That's how I scored it, and why I scored it the way I did. Brian has laid out the equipment that was used; on a different day, with different cords/interconnects/speakers/amps -- sure, everything would have sounded a little different.

Thanks again to Brian, who donated his time and made his excellent system available. And thank you Steve, Bon, and Tom for making the effort and sharing your excellent gear for an afternoon.

- Eric
I agree with Tvad,

we have been waiting for quite a while for this shootout, and no one has so far come clean with the details. I am sure thee is a signature to each one which pople can relate to and make decisions possibly as to which one for them is the best.

I get the feeling everyone got on too well, and politeness has been the order of the day. I am sure 711 smiling will soon make his voice heard loud and clear.
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My specific ratings were DV50 (48) Modright (47) APL (47). Since my sister doesn't post, her preference was the APL, DV50, and Modright in that order. I don't know her exact scores, but they were as close as all the others. FYI, my sister has been involved in music for 35 years and currently sings with The Apollo Chorus of Chicago. She has great ears and a nice system of her own.

I would disagree with Eric on just one main issue. I thought the DV-50 clearly won the battle of detail retrieval. The only other area that I scored it clearly ahead was in bass definition. As far as the "damped" observation, I thought the DV-50 was playing at a slightly lower volume during its review which may account for this. Other than those thoughts, I have absolutely no complaints about the shootout, outcome, or any of the players.

Brian didn't say much in his first post, but I'm pretty sure I heard him say as he walked into his kitchen "call me crazy, but I thought the DV-50 was the best one." Since I don't know that he kept his scorecard, he'll have to elaborate.

Give it up Brian......:-)

Tom