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Speaker shootout update; aggressive treble eliminating some (fairly?)

I've been trying out speakers in a complicated shoot out, both bookshelves and towers — all in my home with my gear. I'm looking for speakers obtainable up to about $4k but could go up (or down) a bit if the right thing came along.

Basic facts: All speakers were run in at least 100 hours. Room is 27 x 14 x 6.5 ceilings. Powering with all QS tubes, 60w, NOS, tube R2R dac, and decent cables. No terrible reflection points; room not overly live or dampened. REL R 328 sub available but I did most listening without it.

Recent auditions, type:

Klipsch RP 600-M (budget singleton of the group)
Fritz Rev Carbon 7 mk II (bookshelf, 2 way, soft dome)
Focal 936 (tower, 3 way, inverted metal)
Martin Logan Motion 60s XTi (tower, 3 way, AMT)

Coming soon:

Salk SS 6M (bookshelf, 2 way, beryllium)
Dynaudio Evoke 30's (tower, 3 way, soft dome)

Let me speak just to the problems, rather than what was good about the speakers. So far, I've found the Klipsch, Focal, and especially the Martin Logans were all too bright — forward, aggressive, "turn it down" treble.

The ML's were the most impossible to tame and hardest to listen to on more tracks. (I did a lot of hanging of towels and other dampeners and other soft things to try to see if I could bring them to heel. I varied the recordings used. Changed cables/wires. No luck.)

The Focals were occasionally too bright; their bigger problem was a bit too much energy in my small listening space. They were better when I plugged their ports with socks.

I'm looking forward to how the next two speakers sound. The Dynaudio towers, I notice, are 10 inches shorter and half the weight of the other towers; not sure what that might mean, but it could just be right size for my space. I'm looking forward to seeing if the Salks bring more detail to the treble without also being too rolled off or harsh.

Hearing is very personal for physiological and taste reasons. However, if anyone has any thoughts about why I might be experiencing some of the phenomena I am (harsh treble, especially) based on my room or gear, etc., that might help me understand factors I'm not fully appreciating. Thanks.


128x128hilde45
mahgister's avatar
mahgister
12,964 posts
 
You’re spot on with your post about millercarbon.....if his new speakers as he says perfect he wouldn’t have grand plans to modify them in three phases.
EMBEDDING speakers rightfully, mechanically, electrically, and acoustically is not the same than UPGRADING some of their parts( legitimate for those who want to improve the speakers)...

All speakers NEED to be embed in these three dimensions....

We must then distinguish between modyfying, upgrading parts, and embedding them....

Decreasing vibrations from a crossover for example is a modification that is welcome in ALL speakers....

Using a device like my "golden plate" or a Emat to lower the electrical noise floor is welcome on any speakers even one million dollars one...

No piece of gear, be it speakers, dac, amplifier, is at his true potential right out of the box without means implemented to embed them in these 3 dimensions...Thinkin that any piece of gear is what it can be right out of the box, without any work at all to embed them in the room, in the house, and with all the other gear, it is ignorance pure and simple....

Some knows that, most dont even understand what i speak about.....

It seems to me millercarbon understand something.... That’s all....

hilde45's avatar
hilde45 OP
4,974 posts
 
@b_limo et al. Can’t really do the setup as suggested, as it’s a guest bedroom. Plus, set up along the long wall, I’ve got side wall reflections ping ponging all the way along. Short wall has a lot of recommenders, too, but I’m not ginning up that debate. I understand why you're saying it though, given the ceiling challenge I described.

I will be able to move this system in a couple years to a larger room (35 x 25 x 11 ft. ceilings) and the wife’s given me a green light to work with the architect to make the room set up for audio. At that point, I’d likely go for different speakers.

MC, how many speakers have you owned over the years? How many have you tried?
twoleftears's avatar
twoleftears
5,318 posts
 
Let me repeat my recommendation of VA Beethoven Baby Grand, which is a relatively short and slim tower speaker, and which will definitely not cause your ears any stress.  A used pair can be picked up at a very good price, as there is a recent revision out.  See also @Steve
hilde45's avatar
hilde45 OP
4,974 posts
 
@twoleftears  Thanks. At 40" high, my concern would be about my low ceiling and the problems noted previously that other towers caused. So if VA is a suggestion worth making an effort over, I'd need to know why this otherwise fine speaker would *not* repeat the same problems.
jackd
1,066 posts
 
@hilde45 

Would it not be worth trying, though some work, just swapping the location of the gear/couch and the bed?  Don't know often you actually have stay over house guest as opposed to how often you use your system but I don't it is in any way comparable. Also in reference to the new version of the Carbon 7 while still using a Scan Speak soft dome tweeter it is from farther down the line than those used in the higher models like the Rev 7SE and the LS 7 which use the Illuminator and Revelator tweeters.  I own the Carrera SE with the Transducer Labs beryllium tweeter and it is not bright so I don't suspect the newer variation with the Satori Be tweeter is either.  It may have just come down to a supply problem with Transducer Labs during the Pandemic. Also a help in that room might be to borrow an adjustable office/computer chair and adjust the height in small increments plus with the chair to the lowest setting you could use lower stands.  The suggestion of the foward tilt is also a great suggestion as you won't have to tilt that much but use Blu Tak under the speakers for safety. That along with an adjustable chair might help you narrow the problem down a bit. The SS6 may in fact be the speaker for you but you won't know it unless you get some sort of handle on that room with the speakers you have access to now.
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