Speaker shootout update; aggressive treble eliminating some (fairly?)


I've been trying out speakers in a complicated shoot out, both bookshelves and towers — all in my home with my gear. I'm looking for speakers obtainable up to about $4k but could go up (or down) a bit if the right thing came along.

Basic facts: All speakers were run in at least 100 hours. Room is 27 x 14 x 6.5 ceilings. Powering with all QS tubes, 60w, NOS, tube R2R dac, and decent cables. No terrible reflection points; room not overly live or dampened. REL R 328 sub available but I did most listening without it.

Recent auditions, type:

Klipsch RP 600-M (budget singleton of the group)
Fritz Rev Carbon 7 mk II (bookshelf, 2 way, soft dome)
Focal 936 (tower, 3 way, inverted metal)
Martin Logan Motion 60s XTi (tower, 3 way, AMT)

Coming soon:

Salk SS 6M (bookshelf, 2 way, beryllium)
Dynaudio Evoke 30's (tower, 3 way, soft dome)

Let me speak just to the problems, rather than what was good about the speakers. So far, I've found the Klipsch, Focal, and especially the Martin Logans were all too bright — forward, aggressive, "turn it down" treble.

The ML's were the most impossible to tame and hardest to listen to on more tracks. (I did a lot of hanging of towels and other dampeners and other soft things to try to see if I could bring them to heel. I varied the recordings used. Changed cables/wires. No luck.)

The Focals were occasionally too bright; their bigger problem was a bit too much energy in my small listening space. They were better when I plugged their ports with socks.

I'm looking forward to how the next two speakers sound. The Dynaudio towers, I notice, are 10 inches shorter and half the weight of the other towers; not sure what that might mean, but it could just be right size for my space. I'm looking forward to seeing if the Salks bring more detail to the treble without also being too rolled off or harsh.

Hearing is very personal for physiological and taste reasons. However, if anyone has any thoughts about why I might be experiencing some of the phenomena I am (harsh treble, especially) based on my room or gear, etc., that might help me understand factors I'm not fully appreciating. Thanks.


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@lemonhaze71
I'm glad you say the low ceiling is not a disaster. A lot of things have sounded quite amazing, so perhaps I've just figured out where the low ceiling factor becomes a major issue, untreated.

I will try to learn REW, and HolmImpulse also. It's helpful to hear what you're using the software for, as I don't really know how to go about with analysis. This is probably why folks keep telling me to contact GIK — because there's a lot to this, and my fumbling around isn't going to get me that far. Still, knowing what I can use a *few* things the tools for to help my room (and speaker choice) a little bit is something I can seek out for the moment. I can at least seek to learn something about the major problems getting in the way of the test speakers' having a fair hearing. I have already taken some steps to soften the rooms reflection points, though I have not used measurement to know exactly how it helps. In this way, I am effectuating your comment about not trying to match "speaker to room or room to speaker is," though I am not yet on the way toward a scientific target.

Regarding this basement's floor, the room has a concrete floor with thin wall to wall carpeting, but also several thicker area rugs, other furniture (couch, leather chair, bed, wooden chest covered with a blanket), so there's quite a range of absorbtion and diffusion going on.

Regarding ceiling reflections, I may look into replacing the blanket and getting an OC73 absorber but I'd hope I can just mount it temporarily without getting into a DIY project at the start. Given that I'm not sure how far apart the speakers should be, ultimately, I'm not sure whether or not 4ft X 8ft will cover the correct area, though maybe there's a lot of wiggle room in something 8 feet across?

Bass traps — noted. I'm not finding any problems with the bass that make me want to set up traps *before* making a speaker choice. Still, if as you say there could be issues with frequencies *above* the bass which are affected by peaks or nulls, then some home-made experimentation may be in order. I appreciate you mentioning some targets to shoot for, such as 400 ms and T60. I bought a miniDSP mic that I can put at my listening position or at other places in the room (I obviously need to read about how to go about this), and see if I can figure out the software.

FYI, the rear wall is actually a built in bookshelves above cabinets that run the entire length of the room, with books of various heights all along. The two side walls are far away though I will confess that the speakers are not the same distance from either side wall. A bit hard to explain. My electrical setup has limits which necessitate this arrangement.

Anyway, super helpful post. Thank you.

@jtcf  Good luck with your search, too!
@pelletfan Thanks for your post. So far so good, but I’m going to put them through their paces.
Your suggestion of a stand is SUPER helpful.
Select the stand height so that the tweeters are at or just above your ear level where listening.
@pelletfan I will, and Oldhvymec's suggestion to lower my listening chair has been factored in, too. Luckily, I have two stands to try out and between them I can get speakers firing appropriately.

Today will be about trying speakers at different distances and trying to learn the REW software. After learning how to do basic measurements, I'll begin to correlate what those measurements say with what I experience; hopefully, I can find a way to use the tool to optimize the trials.
Well the good news is sounds like you have about as good of a floor as you can acoustically especially in regards to bass. Should result in clean articulate bass not boomy that does not obscure midrange detail. With upper frequencies under control via right gear for you and whatever treatments you might apply that should get you to a good place. You certainly have had lots of good suggestions and options to consider. You might even miss the fun of tweaking once you get things nailed! 🙏
@mapman Yes, I may be approaching a good state. In order to stop fussing about audio, I may have to start investigating espresso machines and grinders. In other words, get a side-quest rolling to divert whatever OCD tendencies have been stirred up so that I can put a period on the end of this long audio sentence and just "enjoy the music," as the hackneyed phrase goes.