**** In documentary Wynton talks about history of music and jazz and he says ’this led to that’ and so on (’there was swing, than came the bop’, etc)
So, if we follow that line, it looks quite logical, even the musical examples are making sense, it seems that really some styles are developed from the previous ones, or on the base of it.****
That is exactly right; it is quite logical. It is even more logical when, as you noted, the musical examples make the point. This goes to another one of the misconceptions about this music on the part of some. There have been many attempts to discuss this here with, unfortunately, little success. Some think that, for instance, bebop appeared in a vacuum; that all of a sudden ”Modern Jazz” appeared independent of what came before it. Far from it. The evolutionary process in Jazz is one of the most important in understanding the music. Btw, same idea applies to Classical music; the music of one era builds on what was done before.
The evolution of Jazz builds on what was done before. Bebop could not have occurred had there been no swing; it built on what swing did. Swing could not have occurred had there been no Ragtime; it built on what Ragtime did.
**** At which point do you think that jazz, as music form was created, pure and free from any possible previous influences? ****
Did not happen that way. Could not have happened that way. That is the whole point of the evolutionary process. Even in its infancy, Jazz was built on previous influences.
In Ragtime, Scott Joplin created a music style which has as a primary feature the syncopated, or jagged, rhythms of the Cuban “Habanera”; which itself was built on the influences of European and African music. Is it a surprise that Cuba is very near New Orleans? Then we had W.C. Handy who collected folk songs as he travelled through Mississippi which used what we now know as “the blues form”. Jelly Roll Morton is credited with “creating” Jazz around the turn of the 20th century by incorporating the jagged rhythms of Ragtime with the “Blues” sound and form.
Btw, it is probably best, for the sake of a discussion such as this and to avoid confusion, to not use “form” as a synonym for “style”. “Form” is a particular structure that a music or specific piece of music uses as its framework. For example, the Blues typically uses a repeated 12 measure form.
Important elements of what we call “Blues” can be demonstrably traced to Africa. The elements of harmony in Ragtime and Blues can be demonstrably traced to Europe. I don’t think it needs to be explained why there existed the cultural influences of Europe and Africa in places like Cuba and New Orleans. All these cultural influences came together in then very cosmopolitan New Orleans in a melting pot of musical ideas to create Jazz; and that was the foundation for all the Jazz styles that followed.
Jazz is a continuum of concepts and ideas that builds on and expands on concepts that preceded it; all with the underlying primary concept of freedom (improvisation). This is why Jazz is considered the quintessential American art form. As American culture developed (for better or for worse) this development (evolution) was reflected in the changing Jazz styles. Think about what was happening politically in America and with the encroachment of technology in American culture and you will find an almost perfect parallel in Jazz.
https://youtu.be/oUaLc1zabVo
So, if we follow that line, it looks quite logical, even the musical examples are making sense, it seems that really some styles are developed from the previous ones, or on the base of it.****
That is exactly right; it is quite logical. It is even more logical when, as you noted, the musical examples make the point. This goes to another one of the misconceptions about this music on the part of some. There have been many attempts to discuss this here with, unfortunately, little success. Some think that, for instance, bebop appeared in a vacuum; that all of a sudden ”Modern Jazz” appeared independent of what came before it. Far from it. The evolutionary process in Jazz is one of the most important in understanding the music. Btw, same idea applies to Classical music; the music of one era builds on what was done before.
The evolution of Jazz builds on what was done before. Bebop could not have occurred had there been no swing; it built on what swing did. Swing could not have occurred had there been no Ragtime; it built on what Ragtime did.
**** At which point do you think that jazz, as music form was created, pure and free from any possible previous influences? ****
Did not happen that way. Could not have happened that way. That is the whole point of the evolutionary process. Even in its infancy, Jazz was built on previous influences.
In Ragtime, Scott Joplin created a music style which has as a primary feature the syncopated, or jagged, rhythms of the Cuban “Habanera”; which itself was built on the influences of European and African music. Is it a surprise that Cuba is very near New Orleans? Then we had W.C. Handy who collected folk songs as he travelled through Mississippi which used what we now know as “the blues form”. Jelly Roll Morton is credited with “creating” Jazz around the turn of the 20th century by incorporating the jagged rhythms of Ragtime with the “Blues” sound and form.
Btw, it is probably best, for the sake of a discussion such as this and to avoid confusion, to not use “form” as a synonym for “style”. “Form” is a particular structure that a music or specific piece of music uses as its framework. For example, the Blues typically uses a repeated 12 measure form.
Important elements of what we call “Blues” can be demonstrably traced to Africa. The elements of harmony in Ragtime and Blues can be demonstrably traced to Europe. I don’t think it needs to be explained why there existed the cultural influences of Europe and Africa in places like Cuba and New Orleans. All these cultural influences came together in then very cosmopolitan New Orleans in a melting pot of musical ideas to create Jazz; and that was the foundation for all the Jazz styles that followed.
Jazz is a continuum of concepts and ideas that builds on and expands on concepts that preceded it; all with the underlying primary concept of freedom (improvisation). This is why Jazz is considered the quintessential American art form. As American culture developed (for better or for worse) this development (evolution) was reflected in the changing Jazz styles. Think about what was happening politically in America and with the encroachment of technology in American culture and you will find an almost perfect parallel in Jazz.
https://youtu.be/oUaLc1zabVo