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Help me understand "the swarm" in the broader audiophile world

I'm still fairly new out here and am curious about this Swarm thing. I've never owned a subwoofer but I find reading about them--placement, room treatments, nodes, the crawl, etc--fascinating. I'm interested in the concept of the Swarm and the DEBRA systems, and I have a very specific question. The few times I've been in high-end, audiophile stores and asked about the concept of the Swarm, I've tended to get some eye-rolling. They're selling single or paired subwoofers that individually often cost more and sometimes much more than a quartet of inexpensive, modest subs. The same thing can be said for many speaker companies that make both speakers and subs; it's not like I see Vandersteen embracing the use of four Sub 3's. 

My question is this: do in fact high-end stores embrace the concept of multiple, inexpensive subs? If not, cynicism aside, why not? Or why doesn't Vandersteen or JL or REL and so on design their own swarm? For those out here who love multiple subs, is it a niche thing? Is it a certain kind of sound that is appealing to certain ears? The true believers proselytize with such zeal that I find it intriguing and even convincing, and yet it's obviously a minority of listeners who do it, even those who have dedicated listening rooms. (I'm talking about the concept of four+ subs, mixed and matched, etc. I know plenty of folks who embrace two subs. And I may be wrong about all my assumptions here--really.)

Now, one favor, respectfully: I understand the concept and don't need to be convinced of why it's great. That's all over literally every post on this forum that mentions the word "sub." I'm really interested in why, as far as I can tell, stores and speaker companies (and maybe most audiophile review sites?) mostly don't go for it--and why, for that matter, many audiophiles don't either (putting aside the obvious reason of room limits). Other than room limitations, why would anyone buy a single JL or REL or Vandy sub when you could spend less and get ... the swarm? 


northman
audiokinesis
2,743 posts
 
Mahgister wrote:

"With acoustic ACTIVE devices controls and not only PASSIVE materials treatment, they gives me so much bass..."

"You forget Active acoustical device controls..."

"For example how do we use reverberations in a positive way to make the sound more alive with only a passive treatment? No way, it takes active acoustical control devices..."

"Active acoustic devices controls seems totally unknown"

"The easiest low cost way to improve bass is to improve the acoustical settings controls of the room not only passively but actively..."

You mention ACTIVE acoustical control devices many times, in this thread and elsewhere, and I don’t know what you are referring to.

Can you describe or explain what they are?

Duke
mahgister's avatar
mahgister
13,102 posts
 
Active devices controls of the room with a balance between, absorption, reflections, and diffusions, and using device (different diffusors of my creation and active resonators connected to a grid of low cost Schumann generators) to take the positive side of reverberations for example....

Active because i connect them to the S.G..... And the different resonators of different size .... I use my audio room only for music then it is possible to experiment....In a common room my device are not esthetical nor practical....

But i think it is not the thread to describe these unorthodox experiments of mine...My only point is treating the room must be made for all frequencies and in relation to timbre accuracy first and not bass....

:)

 I apologize for having disrupted this thread.....

My best to all....
lalitk's avatar
lalitk
5,560 posts
 
@mahgister,

Why not start a thread with a detailed explanation of your three infamous embeddings? I think it’s long overdue :-)
audiokinesis
2,743 posts
 
Thank you mahgister.

What do you mean by "active resonators"? Are these Helmholtz resonators, and/or do they have moving parts? Do they operate in the audible band? 

Duke
mahgister's avatar
mahgister
13,102 posts
 
I called them active because they resonate in diffusing the sound....They are also many of them connected to my Shumann generators.... I use also Helmholtz resonators....But the resonators i use most were cheap brass cap or cone of different size in some grids...Connected or not... With some minerals in the center or not..... My diffusors plays a great role also... I use a grid of "strings of cheap minerals" suspended from the ceilings, some are connected some not.....Very efficient to diffuse the sound.... The main problem was for me the balance between reflective, absorbent and diffusive surface or device...

They are certainly audible because i only use my ears.... :)

I take many months to create this room.... And there is no comparison at all in nearfield or regular position with before and after....

It is why acoustic control for me exceed often upgrading electronic component in powerful transformation of S.Q.
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