hidden gem in there by both Ralph and Raul....about vac hold down or clamps or mat material causing a lack of air or is it ( my words ) just reducing a distortion we like ? .....
TONEARM DAMPING : DAMPED OR NOT ? ? USELESS ? ? WELCOMED ? ?
Dear friends: This tonearm critical subject sometimes can be controversial for say the least. Some audiophiles swear for non damped tonearms as the FR designs or SAEC or even the SME 3012 that is not very well damped in stock original status.
Some other audiophiles likes good damped tonearms.
In other thread a gentleman posted:
" If a cartridge is properly matched to the tonearm damping is not required. " and even explained all what we know about the ideal resonance frequency range between tonearm and cartridge ( 8hz to 12hz. ). He refered to this when said: " properly matched to the tonearm ".
In that same thread that a Triplanar tonearm owner posted:
" This is the one thing about the Triplanar that I don't like. I never use the damping trough...... I imagine someone might have a use for it; I removed the troughs on my Triplanars; its nice to imagine that it sounds better for doing so. "
At the other side here it's a very well damped tonearm:
https://audiotraveler.wordpress.com/tag/townshend/
Now, after the LP is in the spining TT platter ( everything the same, including well matched cartridge/tonearm. ) the must critical issue is what happens once the cartridge stylus tip hits/track the LP grooves modulations.
The ideal is that those groove modulations can pass to the cartridge motor with out any additional kind of developed resonances/vibrations and that the transducer makes its job mantaining the delicated and sensible signal integrity that comes in those recorded groove modulations.
That is the ideal and could be utopic because all over the process/trip of the cartridge signal between the stylus tip ride and the output at the tonearm cable the signal suffers degradation ( resonances/vibrations/feedback ) mainly developed through all that " long trip " .
So, DAMPING IS NEED IT AT THE TONEARM/HEADSHELL SIDE OR NOT?
I'm trying to find out the " true " about and not looking if what we like it or not like it is rigth or not but what should be about and why of that " should be ".
I invite all of you analog lovers audiophiles to share your points of view in this critical analog audio subject. WHAT DO YOU THINK ABOUT?
Thank's in advance.
Regards and enjoy the MUSIC NOT DISTORTIONS,
R.
Some other audiophiles likes good damped tonearms.
In other thread a gentleman posted:
" If a cartridge is properly matched to the tonearm damping is not required. " and even explained all what we know about the ideal resonance frequency range between tonearm and cartridge ( 8hz to 12hz. ). He refered to this when said: " properly matched to the tonearm ".
In that same thread that a Triplanar tonearm owner posted:
" This is the one thing about the Triplanar that I don't like. I never use the damping trough...... I imagine someone might have a use for it; I removed the troughs on my Triplanars; its nice to imagine that it sounds better for doing so. "
At the other side here it's a very well damped tonearm:
https://audiotraveler.wordpress.com/tag/townshend/
Now, after the LP is in the spining TT platter ( everything the same, including well matched cartridge/tonearm. ) the must critical issue is what happens once the cartridge stylus tip hits/track the LP grooves modulations.
The ideal is that those groove modulations can pass to the cartridge motor with out any additional kind of developed resonances/vibrations and that the transducer makes its job mantaining the delicated and sensible signal integrity that comes in those recorded groove modulations.
That is the ideal and could be utopic because all over the process/trip of the cartridge signal between the stylus tip ride and the output at the tonearm cable the signal suffers degradation ( resonances/vibrations/feedback ) mainly developed through all that " long trip " .
So, DAMPING IS NEED IT AT THE TONEARM/HEADSHELL SIDE OR NOT?
I'm trying to find out the " true " about and not looking if what we like it or not like it is rigth or not but what should be about and why of that " should be ".
I invite all of you analog lovers audiophiles to share your points of view in this critical analog audio subject. WHAT DO YOU THINK ABOUT?
Thank's in advance.
Regards and enjoy the MUSIC NOT DISTORTIONS,
R.
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- 316 posts total
My Maplenoll Ariadne Signature uses a silicone trough in front of the cartridge on the LT air arm, this combination has a very special bass quality but makes record thickness important. Different record thickness not only changes the VTA but also the depth of the paddle in the trough, that again affect the Tracking weight. Tracking weight is best set with the paddle in the trough and the stylus in perfect play height. I only use this arm for thin records, and have a SME arm for thicker records. |
Here is another cartridge article from from the past (B&O cartridge designer) https://worldradiohistory.com/Archive-All-Audio/Archive-Audio/70s/Audio-1979-03.pdf. A couple of items to grasp is the amount of pressure (1000's of psi) that the stylus is developing, the elasticity of the record (its deforming) and the incredible torturous path the stylus is tracking in highly modulated grooves (i.e. the high frequency that gives the air/life to the music). Everything matters. If the 'system' is over-damped, the stylus will not be able to vibrate or change vibration as quickly - for an electrical equivalent consider it slew-rate (uv/sec) - and the sound will be dead and lifeless. Under-damp and stylus can go out of control and you get distortion and record damage. Critically-damped (system dependent) and it sounds great. Of course this is no easy task and @rauliruegas dissertation above and this very post and so many others like this are clear evidence. I have recently been playing with record mats; a thin leather mat was doing OK, but the suede-side collected lint (visible with UV light) and eventually gave it back to the record. The thin (3mm) Technics rubber mat did not attract lint (must be nitrile rubber - near neutral triboelectric-scale), but was relatively soft (estimate about durometer-50) and sucked the life out of the music (VPI 2" AL platter). I am now testing a 3-layer material as a platter mat (not marketed as a platter mat) that is much stiffer (durometer 85) and the sound is great (and the material may solve static issues - will know more this winter). So the platter mat can have a profound influence because it couples to the record which is not infinitely stiff. So, everything matters - but unfortunately the devil is in the details; and in many ways that 'can' be the appeal of playing records. There are an near infinite number of ways to achieve success (and of course an equivalent near infinite paths to frustration). |
rauliruegas ... you can get way better quality sound using the " tape " around its arm wand. This is a must test you need to do it.Wow! That's electrical tape. I'd never put gooey sticky electrical tape on a pickup arm. If my arm needed that, I'd dump it and buy a proper arm. |
1++ @cleeds Cartridges come critically damped. That is what their suspensions are all about, but they are damped to work in certain types of arms as characterized by mass. If you go outside the mass they are "critically damped" for you will get into trouble. For on arm that is too light you simply at weight (mass.) For an arm that is too heavy, you can take a hack saw to it or you can try and damped it further by various methods to spread out and flatten the resonance peak so that it might not interfere with playback. My own rule of thumb is to discount variables which are highly subjective. Hearing is one of them. Hearing is personal. You can only apply your own. Record playback is just a matter of very simple newtonian physics. Ok, maybe DS Audio enters the quantum realm. |
- 316 posts total