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2020 update : JC Verdier La Platine

A recent encounter with a JC Verdier dealer as well as a recent Audiogon discussion thread led to the start of this thread. He was in my house updating my La Platine which had been in storage for ten years with thread and oil. While he has high regards for the deck, his newer clients nevertheless prefer a Techdas iii than an 'old' La Platine. Given the proliferation of expensive decks in the past dozen years, La Platine has become very much under-appreciated. 

It's clear to me that the influence of the La Platine is everywhere to be found. Specifically, the magnetic suspension system that was employed 30+ years ago. Even SOTA offers their newer decks with mag. lev. features. And if you read this review: https://www.callas-audio.nl/Callas%20Platine%20Mod%20Kit%20Review.pdf, the Continuum Caliburn uses the same concept, which was not acknowledged in Fremer's review, albeit with more sophisticated , and expensive, execution.

It is also clear to me that there is much misunderstanding of the workings of the La Platine. I for one have contributed to this. The motor of the La Platine, for example, has been much maligned. The thread drive is another aspect of the turntable that have been described as inferior. With regard to the motor and thread drive, I have been set straight by Chris @ct0517 and Lyubomir @lbelchev. Experimenting with the different types of silk threads, the tightness to the platter  and a renewed understanding of the soundness of the Philips motor have been rewarded with better dynamics and transparency. 

The funny thing is that during the past two years of re-engagement with audio, I have questioned ownership of every components in my arsenal except the La Platine. It has always been a keeper. I wonder if La Platine owners would contribute to celebrating this 'old' deck with tales, advice, and insights?

Cheers!
ledoux1238
dover
2,273 posts
 
@perart1 
I think we are on the same page. There is a lack of mechanical grunge that is where the Verdier shines over many other TT's. It has a very low noise floor. It is very enticing. I sold the Verdier to a friend who owned an SME20 and he was very happy - it was a big upgrade.
The main issue for me was the speed stability compared to my reference that I could never quite conquer, but there must be some answer.
My feeling would be to replace the motor with an ac hysteresis motor such as used in the old idlers. The standard Verdier motor is simply a small DC motor with an relatively loose power supply. I often thought the cheapest solution would be to use a Garrard motor or Empire motor with an appropriate speed controller. There are some great motors in the old idlers - the motor in my Pioneer broadcast idler is twice the size of the Garrard and substantially quieter. The AC motor used in the Final is roughly the same size as the Garrard, but you cant hear it running until your ear is about an inch away from the pulley and even then its only turbulence, no motor noise.

ledoux1238 OP
302 posts
 
@ perart1 The disparity between MDF and Granito plinth is very informative. Not much discussion here. I suppose the same goes for the arm board. Solid wood (ebony ) or wood / brass combination trumps the MDF arm board, I'd imagine. 

The Callas Mod Kit, I think, deals with more than the bearing. The following is a link to a review of the mod kit: 
https://www.callas-audio.nl/Callas%20Platine%20Mod%20Kit%20Review.pdf
The reviewer reports on one of the most important aspect of the mod kit: the ability to control the magnetic force asserted on the platter. This in turn increases the bass performance of the La Platine. The reviewer claims that the Continuum Audio Caliburn turntable in fact has magnetic repulsion similar to La Platine. But the designer, Mark Dohmann, incorporated a mechanism for controlling the magnetic forces. That was the partial reason for the exorbitant price of the Calibrun.

@ Dover, I appreciate your frank assessment of the La Platine MDF version. The discussions here have confirmed that it is a TT that requires multiple increments of tweaks and improvements. There are plenty of advocates for the original motor, however, I appreciate your calling out its defects. While I have not done the battery powered conversion nor any of the Callas Audio tweaks, I believe I fall in the camp calling for wholesale replacement of the motor. The question is which motor to replace it with. I am leaning toward a motor that will work the thread drive, SOTA, Galibier..or perhaps your Final audio?
dover
2,273 posts
 
ledoux,

Thanks for the feedback.
The Final Audio stuff is unobtainable now.
I prefer AC motors because they lock to frequency and error correction due to stylus drag is self induced and reasonably benign, whereas DC motors require constant monitoring and speed correction via some form of feedback system.

The reason for the proliferation of DC motors in TT’s is because they are cheap and speed controllers are cheap to build.

The SOTA eclipse package looks to be great value at the moment.
I’m pretty sure its a 3 phase AC motor with speed controller.
I have heard a TW Accustic motor sytem on a Micro Seiki 5000 and it didn’t seem to offer much improvement over the original.

With the recent interest in restoring idlers there are now many speed controllers available for the big AC motors eg Classic Turntable Coy, Longdog Audio etc. Since there are also now parts (bearings, bushes, coils remanufactured ) for Garrard motors they are possibilities.



ledoux1238 OP
302 posts
 
@ perart1 Would you consider selling the Callas Mod Kit?
perart1
9 posts
 
ledoux1238

I think that If i felt that i needed to improve the stock motor i would look seriously at the Galibier as it is now in production. You could always fo for the Dereneville!!!!!! The motor of choice on WTBF. (said tongue in cheek). I tried the TW motor and there was little difference to the stock motor.

I think that i bought the last Callas kit and I am not sure that they will be made, and yes i am aware of what the kit is supposed to do. I will install it one of these days just to see. I have not heard of anyone commentating on the 'improvement' it brings. 

I can not think of any turntable that has been in continuous production for so long and not been 'improved' by the manufacturer. Its principles have benn copied and adapted by many.Linn have consistently been 'adding value' to their product over the years. With the advances in materials science and technology Verdier could have made the VP a more effective package. Their nouvelle platine has  had some development work done by auditorium23 with Verdier's involvement and blessing, but with a restriction that it should not be sold outside of Germany.

Peter


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