Arcam, Musical Fidelity questions...

The following two points should have been included in my original post:

1. It’s perfectly possible that dac design has advanced in the time since the FMJ 23 was introduced, so that the ring dac has been equaled or surpassed by the dacs in the FMJ 36. It’s also possible that other aspects of the design/parts of the FJM 23 have been improved on.

2. The only way to resolve the ring dac/FJM 23 issue is a side-by-side comparison of the FMJ 23 with the FMJ 33 or 36. Personally, I’d love to hear a shootout between all three. At 1/3 the cost of a new 36, the used 23 is certainly cheap. If you believe that you won’t give up much with the 23, I’d buy and use it while seeing where digital front end audio goes. It’s a truism that digital is the area of audio that is evolving fastest and has the greatest obsolescence.

I agree with your premise, the CD23 is the best value of the bunch. It's a tough call between which sounds better, the 23 or 33. I preferred the 23 by a small margin, due to its smoothness. The 33 is a little more forward, which some of my friends prefer.

I've listened to the 23 headsup against an A5 and preferred the 23. The overrall soundstage was wider and deeper, and there was better bass response.

I agree with the above poster, the Ayre CX-7 outdoes them all. But the main advantage is only if you're running balanced. If you're running single-ended, I'd say it's 5% or so better than the 23. If it's balanced, it's more like 15-20%. I switched from the 23 to the Ayre because I got a balanced amp, but I thoroughly enjoyed my time with the 23.

I really appreciate all the responses, I agree that the Ayre would probably be the best of the bunch but while my amp to my pre does run via a balanced connection. The pre does not have a balanced input for the CD player, so I think the 5% bump in performance I'd get over the CD23 (running single ended) is probably not worth the $1,300 more (used) that I'd have to pay.

As a pure value proposition it appears the CD23 is the way to go. I'm waiting for the FMJ CD23T to surface and then I'll try to pick one up.

Thanks again.

I own the original FMJ cd-23 (not the text version) and it's been a great-sounding, reliable player. Decodes HDCD, too. (not sure if the newer players still do that). I have never a/b compared it directly to the newer 33 or 36 in my system, however.

I worked in a shop that sold Arcam (and Meridian, among other things) during the late 90's to early 00's and had the chance to get product training from the Arcam factory reps on the features/benefits of the Ring-Dac design when it was first coming to market in their players. It certainly was ahead of it's time in 1999 for a $2k player and I suspect that's why they can still hold their own today and sound great. I spent time in the shop listening to the cd 23 compared to the then-current Meridian 508-24 and bought the Arcam. I just couldn't justify the huge jump in cost for what to me was not a night/day difference in sound. To me the Meridian was a touch dryer-sounding and there was something about the Arcam player that really reeled me in to the music.

The main reason the Arcams no longer use the Ring-Dac is that they only licensed the technology from DCS for a short period of time. I never heard of the difficulty to manufacture/reliability issue as a reason to discontinue it although I suppose that's possible. I suspect cost was probably a bigger factor, though. Also, the Ring-Dac in the Arcam player is not the full-blown spec found in DCS gear, rather Arcam used the major elements of the DCS design to create a custom chipset to be used first in their Alpha 9 and later FMJ series players. It's like getting the low-fat version of the DCS stack, Sounds great, without the guilt! If you are on a budget, you might want to try to find an Alpha 9 which will cost less than an FMJ series player and still have most of the performance.

As for comparing the sound to an Ayre or MF, I can't help you there. But my experience with the FMJ series Arcam is that it's very well made gear and it's fair to say the performance will hold it's own against more expensive equipment from other manufacturers even today. Of course it's all a matter of personal taste when you get to that level of performance anyway. Good luck! JZ