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Solid state amplifiers and sound stage, especially front to back "depth"

I've been enjoying my trial period with the Van Alstine SET 400 stereo amplifier. When I'm done and have collected my thoughts, I may write up a summary.

In the meantime, a question for folks with more experience. I've noticed is that the amp produces a sound stage that is nicely defined and articulate from left to right, but not as much from front to back. (My Adcom was also unable to create sound stage depth.) I know my room is capable of that sound stage because my tube amp accomplishes it.

Question: Is it typical of solid state amps to have less of a front to back sound stage than tube amps? Do they vary in this regard? Or, perhaps, am I failing to do something -- such as re-position my speakers? (After all, I immediately get that sound stage back when I switch amplifier without moving anything else.)

If you have any experience with solid state amplifiers and sound stage -- front to back, left to right, or whatever, I'm curious.

This is not about me keeping or not keeping the amp. There are many things I already really like about it. But I'm wondering about this aspect.

Thanks.
128x128hilde45
testrun
218 posts
 
I went from PrimaLuna integrated to Bel Canto Ref600M's (class "D") and believe sound stage improved. Still breaking in but happy so far.  For reference I am using a tube preamp. 
zlone
424 posts
 
Great question and good discussion. I have a Freya + preamp that allows me to choose between solid state and tube front end. The difference is very clear between the two with a good soundstage left to right for both modes, but the tubes add depth. As others have stated, the recording matters as well, but I am assuming you have some good test tracks. Maybe try a tube preamp in front of the SET 400?
jjss49's avatar
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jjss49
6,612 posts
 
most probably have already seen it but the related current topic 'why do want distortions' has an ongoing discussion that has bearing on this one... esp. the contributions by ralph of atmasphere
atmasphere's avatar
atmasphere
11,620 posts
 
So far, if I'm paying attention, only the Sunfire 300 amp has been given props for an amazing soundstage.
I've heard some class D amps that do very well too.

"I have no clue about "voicing" an amplifier. It is NOT a musical instrument. It is not supposed to "sound good". The best it can do is to not screw up the information presented at its inputs and drive whatever load is connected to it without interacting with or being modified by the load….We will leave "voicing" to trumpets and tubas and such, and keep doing basic evaluation of circuit electronics…..We did not spend any time "voicing", only refining our engineering knowledge and the application of that." [Source: https://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=76587.20 ]

That's a surprising thing to hear from someone who makes good gear. Surely he listens to what his customers say, he goes to shows, listens to gear, etc. He may have said this as some kind of retort to someone else's overly-mushy (from an engineer's standpoint) statements. But without that kind of charity for him, it betrays an unenviable bull-headedness.
I can't agree with this. Frank's comments are spot on and I feel exactly the same way. Voicing an amplifier is likely to simply result in some sort of synergy with some other equipment and ultimately, any audio product has to stand on its own merits and not rely on another's to sound right. IOW designing for synergy or 'voicing' is likely going to result in more distortion.
hilde45's avatar
hilde45 OP
4,819 posts
 
@twoleftears Perhaps a different positioning for a different amp is called for — that’s why my question included "Or, perhaps, am I failing to do something -- such as re-position my speakers?" That said, I’ve done measurements regarding impulses (first reflection, distal reflection, further reflections) and I don’t see much of a measurement difference between them regarding the kinds of timing that contribute to sound stage. I suppose just moving the speakers around would be an easy experiment. Thanks for that idea!

@audioguy85 I did a lot of movement of my system and back wall distance proved very important, both for SPL and for imaging. My guess is that rooms are very different, and my 6.5 ft. ceilings are a factor which probably you (and Fremer) don’t share. Possible crucial difference.

@zlone Wow, that’s a very controlled experiment and interesting result. Yes, I use great test tracks and yes, I’m using a tube preamp in front of both amps. With NOS Valvo 12ATs in it.

@jjss49 I’ll look at the distortions discussion.
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