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Best tube amp for electrostatic speakers

For over 35 years I've almost exclusively used either ribbons or electrostats with solid state amplification and have been generally happy with the sound. Over the last several years, though, my hearing has become somewhat degraded and more sensitive to certain frequencies. The frequencies which seem to cause the most discomfort occur in the 1400 to 1900Hz range and come across as "bright" to my hearing. After researching this matter and having been given some expert advice, I've decided to pursue the idea of replacing my present amplification equipment with tube based gear.

The purpose of this post, then, is to solicit advice regarding the best approach to making this decision based on the following information: the current basic equipment is Shanling Solid state CD player, Peachtree Audio Nova used as preamp, two DBX 1531 EQ's to help compensate for age related hearing loss, Peachtree 220 amp, Silversonic T114 cable and Martin Logan Ethos speakers.

The listening area is our living room measuring 15 by 22 feet with my listening position 16 feet from the plane of the 2 speakers which are positioned 11 feet apart measured center to center. Located between the 2 speakers is an entertainment center which is about 9 feet wide. My listening interests are varied from solo guitar and light jazz to occasional orchestral music. I don't generally listen at high volumes and am not particularly interested in strong bass except for the rare action movie background.

Unless not advisable for some reason, I would like to keep the Peachtree Nova as a preamp because of the significant latitude for source connection and what seems to have a decent internal DAC. If this option would substantially defeat the purpose of the intended modification I would work around it. I can no longer deal with sounds that are "bright" which I now find uncomfortable but detailed sound is very important.

So, the questions are: is the move to tubes the best option and, if so, what might be some reasonably priced amps that could accomplish the goal. This, of course, would take into consideration room size, etc. for determining power requirements. If there are other more practical and less expensive options to consider, I would appreciate that advice as well.
broadstone
mrmb's avatar
mrmb
299 posts
 
It's tough enough for us to find systems that fulfill our wants/needs without trying to find equipment that "repairs" auditory limitations. You mentioned that a perçussive source such as a piano bothers you. I wonder if that is the case with live piano music? If not, then obviously your responding (bothered by) your present audio setup. But you've probably already made that distinction -- performed the is it live vs recording reproduction test.

I'm in agreement that your sources are less than reference level. Since its inception the silver disc has presented brightness issues that are nicely ameliorated by some of the better, more current digital sources.

With that said, I run stats in both my H/T system and in my 2-channel audio room -- Martin Logan's & Aragon 5-channel ss amplification in the former and Soundlabs & CAT tube amplification in the latter. Of course each room sounds different, but neither has objectionable frequency ranges.

My suggestion is to be very careful trying to correct objectionable frequencies with a specific design/type (e.g. tube) equipment. In your shoes, I suppose I would try to find a system at a friend's, dealer's, audio show that doesn't bother you to make sure that the problem isn't an organic one. And if not, try new sources and amplification (perhaps even speakers) until you find a combination that you can live with.

At any rate, good luck.....
georgehifi's avatar
georgehifi
10,312 posts
 
Broadstone, look and you can see in the graphs 1 2 & 3 of the new reincarnation of the highly regarded Mcintosh 275.

You can see that the black trace is what happens to the frequency response of the amp that can't do current as I've outlined above into a simulated dynamic speaker load.
The upper mid/ to highs are considerably rolling off, and the whole amp is acting like a tone control

Now into the 1ohm of the Ethos this will be even more rolled off, as it is much more severe.

http://www.stereophile.com/content/mcintosh-mc275-power-amplifier-measurements

Cheers George
georgehifi's avatar
georgehifi
10,312 posts
 
Now this is the actual simulated speaker load sterophile use.
Overlay it with what's above and you can see that the Ethos is going to be much lower at 1ohm in the upper mid treble. And therefore will severely roll off in this area.

http://www.stereophile.com/content/real-life-measurements-page-2

Cheers George

almarg's avatar
almarg
9,670 posts
 
Regarding the measurements cited in George's two posts just above, I would emphasize that the frequency responses and rolloffs that are described apply to electrical signals at the amplifier output/speaker input, not to the acoustic output of the speaker. As I said earlier:
01-14-15: Almarg
... while it is true that when working into an electrostatic such as the Ethos the use of a tube amp, especially one which uses minimal or no global feedback, is likely to result in voltage vs. frequency characteristics at the input terminals of the speaker that are less flat than would result from the use of most solid state amps, it by no means necessarily follows that the frequency response characteristics of the acoustic output of the speaker will be flatter in the latter case. As can be seen in the comments by Ralph (Atmasphere).
The successful pairing of tube amps with electrostatics by many experienced audiophiles, as can be seen in system descriptions and posts here and elsewhere, confirms the importance of distinguishing between flat frequency response into the speaker, and flat frequency response out of the speaker. They don't necessarily go hand in hand, particularly in the case of electrostatics. IMO.

Regards,
-- Al
atmasphere's avatar
atmasphere
12,104 posts
 
As I have pointed out many times in the past, the impedance curve of an ESL is not the same as an efficiency curve.

With many box speakers the two are the same- higher impedances usually representing resonance, usually a driver in a box.

(If one were to apply this idea to an ESL, it is easy to see how one would think that you need lots of current to drive those low impedances. In a nutshell, it does not work that way with ESLs; they simply are not the same technology!)

ESLs are generally not in a box; their impedance curve is a result of a capacitive function unrelated to resonance.

The result is that the speaker generally needs a constant power characteristic out of the amp rather than a constant voltage characteristic in order to obtain flat frequency response. Constant voltage is that quality that allows an amplifier to double power as impedance is halved (and will generally result in brightness in ESLs). Constant power is that quality where power remains constant regardless of impedance.

There is more at this link:
http://www.atma-sphere.com/Resources/Paradigms_in_Amplifier_Design.php

While the Power Paradigm pretty well went the way decades ago in mid- and lo-fi situations, it is still very much alive and well in high end. Horns, ESLs, magnetic planars, single-driver full range speakers and various conventional box speakers represent examples of speakers made to conform to Power Paradigm rules.
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