Classic Ortofon Cartridges: The MC2000 MK II or the MC3000 MK II?


So I have owned quite a few Otofon cartridges over the years, everything from the modest OM cartridges to a couple of Cadenza up to an A90. I typically enjoy Ortofon cartridges.

Now one I have never owned is the MC2000. It seems from a bit of reading I have done that owners of the MC2000 felt it was the most accurate of the Ortofon cartridges, and that releases after it were not its equal.

However, when you look at the MC3000 it has a higher output level that would allow it to work with my Esoteric phono stage. The Esoteric is happy running an MC200 on it which has .09 mV output. but the MC2000 is .05 mV. The MC 3000 MK II is .13 mV from what I find.

Has anyone spent time listening to these classic MC 000 series of Ortofon cartridges? I know there is also a 5000 and 7500, but those seem to be pretty rare.

Regarding the MC2000, I wonder if I use a low mass headshell if I can use it on the Dynavector DV505. I don’t think the mass of the arm in the horizontal plane should affect it, and the vestigial arm can be configured to be an appropriate match for the compliance on this cartridge.

I currently have an MC200u on the arm and its very surprising regarding how good it sounds. Its actually pretty neutral, pretty expressive, but just a bit relaxed in the top end. I certainly enjoy it, but I wonder how these statement cartridges from the classic Ortofon line will sound. These would have been from their long time designer who has now retired, so its a different era of Ortofon versus what their current offerings are. Even though we should acknowledge that the current cartridges use design principals that were developed from this earlier time period and engineering team. 

Thoughts?
neonknight
My first enigma was the so called ''Greek lier paradox'', The Greek who stated that ''all Greek are liers''. The other was how Greek
succeeded to convince ''Slavic immigants'' on the Balkan to believe in ONLY ONE GOD while they were polytheisic originaly? There are many theories about this ''issue''. However nobody try ''economic kind''. Consider the case with 12 Gods  but with only 10 goats. Back than the ''integrity issue'' deed not exist. So trying to ''corrupt'' Gods was not an issue. But well with the problem how to please 12 of them with only 10 goats? Probaly because man are regarded as more valuable ''working force'' the daughters were ''logicaly'' considered to be less ,uh, valuable. So ''ONLY  two of those'' were needed to please all 12 Gods. Well the Greek deed not need more arguments then  that ONE GOD is much cheaper. 

@lewm

If you and Raul believe that an aluminum oxide by itself can qualify as a ceramic after appropriate processing, ok.

Thats not what I said. Nowhere did I say "after appropriate processing".
I dont know why, but you are forever rephrasing other folks posts, including misrepresenting what they have said.

Let me spell it out for you

Aluminium Oxide is a ceramic oxide.

https://www.sciencedirect.com/topics/materials-science/aluminum-oxide



Yikes, I didn't think body materials would lead to such a lively discussion. Given the hardness of the body used on the MC3000 MK II, which the Stereophile review says almost 9 on the Moh Scale of Hardness, while that scale shows titanium being 6. Apparently hardness is only part of the equation for resonance issues that are considered in body design. 

Nevertheless, all I was really trying to say is that this is a nice sounding cartridge. In the past I have had the Cadenza Red, Blue, Bronze, original Windfeld, and A90 in my systems. While each of these cartridges had a different presentation, I would say I find this Ortofon to be very close to being on equal footing. With the possible exception of the A90, but that cartridge has a unique presentation and kind of stands apart from other Ortofon cartridges. 

It may very well be possible that there are a level of differences that my system is not up to the task of presenting. Actually I find the tables I use to have very similar presentations, and this may be an end result of colorations further down the equipment chain. So lets talk about the system 

Speakers  JBL 4365 and pair of Velodyne HGS 12 subwoofers
Amplifier   AVM Audio AMP Essential monoblocks
Pre-Amplifier  Halcro DM 8
Phono Stage Esoteric E-03
Speaker wire  Wireworld Eclipse 8
Interconnects  Wireworld Silver Eclipse 8
Power cords  Pi Audio Group 
Power Conditioner  TLP Audio TF130 (previous one was a PS Audio P10)

Turntables 

Scheu Audio Das Laufwerk No2/Dynavector DV505/Ortofon MC 3000 II or Ikeda 9 Kawami

Well Tempered Reference/ZYX 4D

SOTA Cosmos Eclipse/SME V/Transfiguration Audio Proteus

There are differences in presentation to all three tables, but there are many many similarities. The SOTA is the most expansive and dynamic, while the WTR is a bit more rounded and relaxed, and the Scheu falls closer to the WTR tonally but a bit more defined and dynamic. 

Perhaps there are limitations in my gear that homogenize the sound. Perhaps one day I get tired of playing with tables and consolidate them into one top tier table I can afford and call it good. Use the digital rig for casual listening and simplify things with one table and a pair of cartridges. Maybe that happens one day, but probably not next week. 

I think the next step is to obtain a different SUT than the ones I have had and see what happens. To be honest this is a casual cartridge, so I don't want to spend multiple thousands on a SUT for a cartridge that cost me $900. But on the other hand, I don't want to kludge the whole thing together either. Perhaps I will look at vintage transformers and see what can be done that way. 
@neonknight playing around with SUT's can be a worthwhile endeavour as an alternative to an active phono amp. In my experience there's no way to predict if a given cartridge will 'like' the phono stage or SUT better, so it's fun every time you 'hit' a synergy, not unlike hitting on the right tonearm/cartridge combination.

That said, I can wholeheartedly recommend the Ortofon SUT's that were built for the '000' series: T-2000, T-3000, T-5000 and T-7500. They were not exactly cheap, but they do have silver wiring and we all know what new SUT's with silver wiring cost these days. Ebay prices are over the top, but I managed to find my T-3000 on Yahoo auction for a little under $1000.

With the exception of the T-2000 they all offer 30dB of gain with a 3-6 ohm impedance range, so suitable for most LOMC's. The T-2000 has 35dB gain to accommodate the extremily low output MC-2000, but that cartridge works great with the T-3000 as well. Its impedance range is fairly flexible too, so even your Proteus with 1 ohm impedance will sound great. And of course the synergy with your MC-3000mk2 is a given. Certainly worth a try!