My wife has the same measurements as Heidi Klum but rest assured they sound and look quite different 😳 😄 😉 😂 !
Cables that measure the same but (seem?) to sound different
I have been having an extended dialogue with a certain objectivist who continues to insist to me that if two wires measure the same, in a stable acoustic environment, they must sound the same.
In response, I have told him that while I am not an engineer or in audio, I have heard differences in wires while keeping the acoustic environment static. I have told him that Robert Harley, podcasters, YouTuber's such as Tarun, Duncan Hunter and Darren Myers, Hans Beekhuyzen, Paul McGowan have all testified to extensive listening experiments where differences were palpable. My interlocutor has said that either it is the placebo effect, they're shilling for gear or clicks, or they're just deluded.
I've also pointed out that to understand listening experience, we need more than a few measurement; we also need to understand the physiology and psychological of perceptual experience, as well as the interpretation involved. Until those elements are well understood, we cannot even know what, exactly, to measure for. I've also pointed out that for this many people to be shills or delusionaries is a remote chance at best.
QUESTION: Who would you name as among the most learned people in audio, psychoacoustics, engineering, and psychology who argue for the real differences made by interconnects, etc.?
In response, I have told him that while I am not an engineer or in audio, I have heard differences in wires while keeping the acoustic environment static. I have told him that Robert Harley, podcasters, YouTuber's such as Tarun, Duncan Hunter and Darren Myers, Hans Beekhuyzen, Paul McGowan have all testified to extensive listening experiments where differences were palpable. My interlocutor has said that either it is the placebo effect, they're shilling for gear or clicks, or they're just deluded.
I've also pointed out that to understand listening experience, we need more than a few measurement; we also need to understand the physiology and psychological of perceptual experience, as well as the interpretation involved. Until those elements are well understood, we cannot even know what, exactly, to measure for. I've also pointed out that for this many people to be shills or delusionaries is a remote chance at best.
QUESTION: Who would you name as among the most learned people in audio, psychoacoustics, engineering, and psychology who argue for the real differences made by interconnects, etc.?
- ...
- 74 posts total
Just for a lark I decided to reinstall some monster speaker cables I had from a few years back. Yeah, danager was here recently and he couldn't see how a power cord could possibly matter so we pulled out one of my old freebies and then when we went back to the Supernova he gasped just to hear the lead-in groove! He is still talking about how the difference was so great he heard it even before the music started! |
Good posts. For an issue which many consider either fruitless or settled, its ability to endure is amazing. Listened to this podcast from just a couple days ago: https://parttimeaudiophile.com/2021/09/09/what-are-meta-materials-do-expensive-cables-matter-the-occ... They discuss the profit margin of cables, the different ways to listen to hear differences, the physics involved, the continued financial success for the industry despite the unending "snake oil" claims, and more. Possibly of interest. I'm gratified to see the example of umami mentioned. It's appropriate, I think. Many people hear differences; many companies are experimenting with designs and materials resulting in further differences heard. To my mind, there's a very good chance that scientific explanations are lagging behind; that's the history of science, right? The unexplained rises up in our experience and then we try to devise tools and measurements to measure, predict, and control experience. But even if that's not the case — let's say that we cannot find a tool & measurement approach to explain why differences are heard. Let's say we discover that, like currency, this is all a huge social construction — people inventing a symbol system with no basis in physical reality. Last I checked, language and money, sports and religions, are all considered real enough by most people. Anyone who considers socially constructed realities as fake is hereby invited to send me their money. (Friends and Family on Paypal is fine.) |
- 74 posts total