Record Cleaning Machines


Has anyone out there done an A/B comparison of the cleaning results or efficacy using the Degritter ultra sonic record cleaning machine which operates at 120 kHz/300 watts and an ultrasonic cleaner that operates at 40 kHz/300 or 380 watts (e.g. Audio Desk; CleanerVinyl; the Kirmuss machine; etc.)?  I have a system I put together using CleanerVinyl equipment, a standard 40 kHz ultrasonic tank and a Knosti Disco-Antistat for final rinse.  I clean 3 records at a time and get great results.  Surface noise on well cared for records (only kind I have) is virtually totally eliminated, sound comes from a totally black background and audio performance is noticeably improved in every way.  Even though the Degritter only cleans 1 record at a time, it seems significantly easier to use, more compact and relatively quick, compared to the system I have now.  I'm wondering if the Degritter's 120 kHz is all that much more effective, if at all, in rendering better audio performance than the standard 40 kHz frequency.  I don't mind, at all, spending a little extra time cleaning my records if the audio results using the Degritter are not going to be any different.  I'm not inclined to spend three grand for a little more ease & convenience and to save a few minutes.  However, if I could be assured the Degritter would render better audio performance results, even relatively small improvements, that would be a whole other story.
oldaudiophile
@oldaudiophile,

You can do a DIY industrial 0.2 micron filter and pump that is as good as it gets for about $350 for best pump, $280 for a smaller less robust pump. The pump draws suction from the tank drain and discharges to the filter back to the tank. Here is the parts list (the primary items are addressed in the book Chapter XIV).

Filter Canister: Pentek 150574 ~$40. Pentek 150574 10" 3G Standard Filter Housing Black/Blue MM IB w/ PR - – Fresh Water Systems

Wrench for Canister: Pentek SW-2 ~$6

Differential Pressure Gauge: Pentek 143549 ~$53 (Green (clean) 0-6 psid; Yellow (change) 6-9 psid; Red (dirty) 9-12 psid) Pentek 143549 Differential Pressure Gauge With 3 Color Needle – Fresh Water Systems

Pump: two options:  These pumps need to be secured to a base such as wood with simple rubber vibration isolators such as  MY MIRONEY 4-Pack 20 x 15mm Rubber Vibration Isolator Mount Shock Absorber with M6 x 18mm Studs: Amazon.com: Industrial & Scientific or a simple rubber pad.  These pumps develop the necessary for the 0.2 micron absolute filter.

Shurflo 8020-513-236 (115VAC) ~$154 Shurflo Pump 8020-513-236 115vAC Power Cord 60PSI Switch 1.6 GPM (toboaenergy.com)

Shurflo Model SLV10-AA48 (12VDC) ~$65 SLV10-AA48 Automatic Demand 12V Pump with On/Off Switch & 2 Pin Connec – Sprayer Depot + 12VDC power supply ~$22 Amazon.com: MEAN WELL GST60A12-P1J 12V 5 Amp 60W Regulated Switching Table Top Power : Everything Else. You have to wire the power supply to the pump motor.

Filter: FlowMax HP (Watts) FPP-0.2-975-DOE 0.2 micron absolute
— ~ $50 Flow-Max FPP-0.2-975-DOE Pleated Filter Cartridge (toboaenergy.com)

Hose Barb for filter canister: x2 nylon Hose Barb ¾" NPT x 3/8” Barb ~$15 LASCO 19-9503 Male Hose Thread Adapter Barb Fitting with 3/8-Inch Barb and 3/4-Inch Male Hose Thread, Nylon - - Amazon.com

Hose Barb for 115VAC Pump: x2 Hose Barb 3/8” NPT x 3/8” Barb — nylon or plastic not metal per Shurflo ~$8 Amazon.com: ANPTGHT Plastic Hose Barb Fitting, 3/8" Barb X 3/8" NPT Male Thread Adapter Connector Pipe Fittings for Fuel Gas Liquid Air (Pack of 5) : Industrial & Scientific

Tubing: 3/8″ ID Heavy Duty Reinforced Vinyl Tubing, BPA Free and Non Toxic — 10 ft ~ $20 Amazon.com: 3/8" ID x 50 Ft High Pressure Braided Clear PVC Vinyl Tubing Flexible Vinyl Tube, Heavy Duty Reinforced Vinyl Hose Tubing, BPA Free and Non Toxic : Patio, Lawn & Garden.

Add hose clamps (5) and one hose barb adapter for the tank drain valve. Use a binder clip (or whatever you want) to secure the hose to the tank top - the terminates in the tank top below the surface.

On/Off Switch for Pump: BindMaster 3-Prong Grounded On/Off Switch ~$7. Bindmaster 3 Prong Grounded Single Port Power Adapter for Outlet with Indicator Lighted On/Off Switch to be Energy Saving {1 Pack}… - - Amazon.com.

Good Luck,
Neil
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Great post, Neil. Thanks for all the filter info, not to mention your LP cleaning "article" that @whart published on his site. As I consider vacuuming off the water after cavitation a must, I came to the conclusion that the Degritter---nice as it is---is not the way to go.

A high-frequency (over 100kHz) ultrasonic tank can be had for under a grand, and your method of pre-cleaning does more to clean the LP than does any other method I've ever been aware of. Add ultrasonic captivation and then vacuuming, and you have an LP as clean as is humanly possible. Pretty easy to do, too.
@antinn, seems I can't thank you enough for this incredible wealth of knowledge, guidance and experience! You are truly amazing! I wish I could express my gratitude more tangibly (e.g. buy you a beer, fine single malt or beverage of your choice).

If I'm not mistaken, that lash-up pump & filter system is what Tima uses. I use a Pentek Big Blue whole-house water filter for my home. Makes lots of sense to incorporate a smaller version for this application.

I've noticed, along the way, that you have judiciously avoided subjective issues like sound quality achieved or capable of being achieved by different record cleaning methods and kept the discussion strictly focused on quantitative cleaning results. Not surprising for a person with a good mind for science! However, I can't help but wonder if you may have some preference(s) for one cleaning method(s) over another as it impacts on sound quality. The prevailing wisdom or opinion in audiophile circles is that US cleaning yields the best sonic results because it obtains the best cleaning results with the least wear & tear on record grooves. Seems to make sense, in theory, but audiophiles are fond of splitting hairs and chasing their tails in search of the holy grail of best audio quality. As such, I can't help but wonder if careful & proper manual cleaning can achieve the same sound quality improvement(s) as other methods with inconsequential wear & tear on those precious record grooves where the music lives.

All the best!
@oldaudiophile,

Yes, the pump/filter system is the same one that Tima uses, and if you read this lengthy comment section  Precision Aqueous Cleaning of Vinyl Records - The Vinyl Press you will see where I worked with Tima to develop it.  I have work with a number of people developing similar pump/filter systems - its gets tough sourcing equivalents for people in Poland & New Zealand.

Regarding what method will achieve the best cleaning, as I wrote in the book - "XII.13 The final chapters of this document will discuss machine assisted cleaning methods: vacuum record cleaning machines (RCM) and ultrasonic cleaning machines (UCM). It’s important to consider that machines are generally developed for two primary reasons – reduce labor and improve process efficiency. Process efficiency can mean faster (higher throughput) and/or higher probability of achieving quality or achieving a quality that manual labor cannot produce. Manual cleaning in the appropriate environment with appropriate controls can achieve impressive levels of cleanliness, but the labor, skill, time and probability of success generally make it impractical for manufacturing environments. But for the home audio enthusiast; depending on your attention to details, adopting machine assisted cleaning may or may not yield a cleaner record. However, the ease of use and convenience provided by machines can be very enticing and cannot be denied."

However, make no mistake, if your process throughput is very high; i.e, you need/want to clean 5-6 records at a time - UT is it.  But, if you are not careful with all the details, you may process records fast, but that does not mean that they will be 'cleaner' than a process/system that cleans one at time.  

Devil is in the details,
Neil