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Question on Denon DL-103 retipping options and preferences

I have been looking at getting a Denon DL-103 retipped and I have narrowed it down to getting it done by Steve at VAS or by Andy at Needle Clinic. 

Both companies approach to the DL-103 is very different and I am curious if anyone has heard cartridges from each or what you think that may be better for amazing sounding rock.

Steve recommends a wood housing and then will do a Boron/MR retipping, where Andy will modify the plastic housing on the DL-103 to convert it's enclosed outer body to a half nude body, lightening it up which he says will make it track better.  His conversion will be a micro ridge nude stylus (sapphire/boron cantilever) 

So as stated very different approaches, same cost for the most part, I have ruled Soundsmith out just based on time, I know Andy turns around in a day, but have read a lot about both so I figured I would ask the question to see where people lean more often.  I do already have an ebony housing, just want to get a cartridge that punches way above its weight.

If there is something I should look at outside the DL-103 I would be open to hear about it.

Just for the record this cartridge will be going on a SOTA Sapphire VI with an Audiomods series 6 tonearm and I have a McIntosh MP100 going to a tube rolled Schiit Freya+ driving by two Odyssey Kismet monoblocks and Martin Logan speakers.  
128x128justinrphillips
johno520
11 posts
 
I had Andy do a cantilever / stylus replacement on a DL-103D in the past 6 months.

He used the Namiki Boron Micro Ridge & he modified the cartridge body to reduce resonance.

I've had this cartridge for 15 years from original.

It that time I've had it rebuilt twice once by Sound Smiths & now by Andy Kim.

The original rebuild by SS used there Ruby LC option which was a marked improvement upon the original cantilever. But the Andy Kim option has turned this cartridge into a true keeper, it really is a step up in SQ compared to the SS option.

Regarding the body modification Andy does IMO it works but is a bit unsightly, so I denuded the cartridge myself and used a Stanley Engineering biscuit which when swapped out only adds an additional 0.5grams compared to original. 

Regarding Andy's service I found him honest & remarkably quick to respond to and the turnaround time was within 2 days of receiving the cartridge.  

Great service Andy.

NEW - Wooden Body NAKED STYLE for DENON DL103 DL103R Cartridge MAHOGANI WOOD | eBay

Cheers Johno

fdroadrunner
33 posts
 
Another vote for Andy.
I've used SS and Andy.  SS did a very good job for which I have no complaints, but Andy's work produced a more marked improvement and a quick turnaround.  When I need another cartridge retipped, I will have Andy do it without thinking twice.
chakster's avatar
chakster
6,144 posts
 
Instead of constant rebuild of one cheap cartridge, designed for radio broadcast in the ’60s, it’s better to buy 3 more different cartridges made in the '80s that already have high-end cantilever and advanced stylus profile.

User replaceable stylus is huge benefit, this is what we call usability, you don't need a re-tipper to buy JICO SAS stylus replacement, they made those super advanced stylus for many vintage MM and the stylus available from their shop. 

For GRACE owners new styli availabe from SoundSmith here. He's got many options from $200 to $500. Basically all you need is a cartridge body. His F9 compatible with F12 and F14 too. I prefer genuine styli, they are hard to find, here is mine (NOS).  

I really don't know why people believe that MC cartridge is better than MM (especially equally priced MM vs. MC) ? 


hdm
1,062 posts
 
"Instead of constant rebuild of one cheap cartridge, designed for radio broadcast in the '60s, it's better to buy 3 more different cartridges that already have high-end cantilever and advanced stylus profile."

Let's see: at $560 divided by 3 that's $185 a piece for cartridges with a boron cantilever and microridge stylus. 

I'll have three of those too! We'll call it the new math/new cartridge/audiophile combo. 


elliottbnewcombjr
5,346 posts
 
So, you haven't even heard the thingy. Have you heard a Denon DL-103 on a friends system? 
Any MC on your system? I hadn't, had to make a choice based on research and advice.

1st you said Rock, then Jazz and Rock. 

My instinct: get the DL-103 going with advanced stylus shape on aluminum, for 'not too much' money, use/hear it, keep it as your base and compare future considerations to it.

I talked to Steve at VAS when I had the same idea as you: buy one broke, fix it, save money. He gave me specific advice when I found opportunities, usually involving potential complications ... I decided to get new.

My first MC is AT33PTG/II (check stock of anything these covid days)

https://hifiheaven.net/shop/Audio-Technica-AT33PTG-2-Dual-Moving-Coil-MC-Cartridge?language=en&c...

to my surprise, in addition to sounding great on my mostly Jazz, it can rock! Santana, War, Rare Earth ... and electronic stuff like Eurythmics, Blue Nile. Slide, banjos: Dicky Betts, Rising Appalachia, Larkin Poe! Violins: check. Piano: check. Stand-Up Bass: check! Drums: check.

Next, my friend gave me a NOS Goldring Eroica LX. 

https://www.goldring.co.uk/goldring-eroica-lx-cartridge.html#tab2

I have it on my 2nd arm, so I can compare to the AT within seconds. Less separation (can be beneficial), the special Gyger II stylus shape is rare, sounds great.
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