Kinki studio EX-M1, EX-M1+ differences... vs Denafrips Hestia/ Hyperion combo?

@jackd
Just wondering how much better your BHK/EX-M7 and Chardonnay/EX-M7 combos sounded than your EX-M1 and in what ways?

A while back I tried to downsize my tube pre/tube amp combo to the EX-M1 (original) but although the EX-M1 was very impressive with low noise floor, dynamics, detail, speed, smoothness, PRaT etc, I just wanted a touch more palpability, organic-ness and ended up selling the EX-M1. Also the EX-M1 had way too much gain, even on low gain setting.

I’m now thinking the EX-M7 with my tube pre-amp might get me to where I want to be. Or, if I need to lose more gain, the Athena and EX-M7.

Also, I can’t find how much gain the EX-M7 has, do you know?

So much information to sort thru here.  May as well add to the fog.  
1st let me say I really, like the ‘unity gain’ style of preamps.  I like the simplicity, the feel, and the quality.  Being fed by a Benchmark Dac3 HGC, I’ve run direct, 0,10, and 20 db attenuation, into the Hyperion & thru the Hestia/Athena.  I have both.  
I find the Denafrips transparent to the source voiced primarily around depth, tone, and dynamics.  They have a certain gravitas and plenty of ‘drive’, particularly in their size/price catagory.  The voicing may be in regards to the class A biasing.  The case can be made that they are unique exquisitely mfg products. 
I run Roon thru a Nuc filtered thru a top end Audio Magic conditioner I’ve modded with Jupiter copper caps on the receptacles.  I’ve 3 dedicated circuits w/10g wiring, & spent a lot of time rolling caps thru the filter stages, Jupiter’s, Cu V-Caps, Duelands, Mundorf SGO, ect… So I would say that my digital source preference is shaded to what the Jupiter caps bring to the table.  

My room is big, 800-1200 sf. and I’ve rolled at least 9 pr. of speakers thru the room, but currently live with the Zu DW’s with (of course) Jupiter caps.  Let’s leave the analog, tape and tubes aside for now.  
The voltage input of the Dac3 does effect the voicing of the system, in general the lower the voltage input the more perceived warmth with or without the preamps.  The less voltage the less attack, or leading edge.
Dac direct, at full output, you can introduce a touch of the dreaded digital glare.  Just a touch.

I understand and have experienced the perceived warmth of the Denafrips voicing as relates to digital and have found it to more naturally align with my analog sources.  Both cassette and vinyl sounded more at home with the Denafrip amps, until…

I brought in a subwoofer to properly ‘load the room’.  I’ve a very good upper corner placement that has enabled a Rel T9i to bring in the 30-40hz and ‘what do you know’, everything has just fallen in place.  My room now sounds the best I’ve attained in over 20+ years of playing around, with tubes and power supplies and speakers, and preamps, ect…

i luv my Hyperion/Hestia. (-;

Now if I could just find the order of tubes for the downstairs system that DHL says was delivered yesterday.

@dkerr 

I have both the original M1 and the current M1+ with the new volume control that rectifies the high gain issue completely and appears from memory to be a slight bit warmer than the original but that could just be a perception from having more flexibility with the volume control. 

As to the issue of the M7 and tube preamps.  I didn't really think the match with the BHK was bad just didn't have the warmth and magic that the pairing with the two 6SN7 preamps have.  Though the BHK has some degree of the tube feel and more so with the 12 volt tubes it's not at all like what you get from a 6SN7 preamp. I do think the M7 is a great amp on it's own but it will not and does not sound like a tube amp.  It is neutral and honest. The closest thing to it that I have owned was the JOB 225. What you put in was what you got out.  My BHK 250 and AVA SET 400 are far "warmer".  So how the pairing of your preamp and the M7 would go would depend mostly on where on the warmth scale your preamp is.  

The Kinki EX-M1 is awesome. Great amplifier with loads of power, extremely black background and great imaging.  I’m very happy with mine!

@jackd 

As to the issue of the M7 and tube preamps. I didn't really think the match with the BHK was bad just didn't have the warmth and magic that the pairing with the two 6SN7 preamps have. Though the BHK has some degree of the tube feel and more so with the 12 volt tubes it's not at all like what you get from a 6SN7 preamp. I do think the M7 is a great amp on it's own but it will not and does not sound like a tube amp. It is neutral and honest. The closest thing to it that I have owned was the JOB 225. What you put in was what you got out. My BHK 250 and AVA SET 400 are far "warmer". So how the pairing of your preamp and the M7 would go would depend mostly on where on the warmth scale your preamp is.

Thanks Jack.

The Herron VTSP-3 (6 x 6922's) is pretty neutral and low noise for a valve pre. Probably less tubey sounding than 6SN7 based preamps. It is not at all syrupy, sweet, lush, soft etc but has excellent transparency, detail, body, dynamics and organicness. 
The Rogue Stereo 100 (4 x KT120's) is also pretty neutral for a tube amp with big dynamic but controlled bass, wonderful 3D imaging and dimensionality, the walls just disappear, so human and organic sounding. Cranked up Money For Nothing yesterday and the growling electric guitar and big opening drums were just awesome. Such natural tone and body. 

I (mostly) loved the original EX-M1 except for way too much gain, a slight unnatural stiffness or overdamped characteristic that I couldn't listen around, and a slight lack of body and organicness/humanity. But I did love the EX-M1's detail, dynamics, immediacy, resolution and liveliness, all presented in a smooth, refined manner. If it had a touch more organicness, humanity, body (and not the strange stiffness) then I would have sold the tube gear and reduced the number of boxes and cables in my system.

That's why I'm contemplating whether the blend of my tube preamp and the EX-M7 would get me my ideal tonal balance (what I have now but moved  just a touch more toward the fast/exciting end from the full-bodied/relaxed end of the spectrum). 

The other option would be to blend a sligthly sunnier preamp with the Rogue tube amp but then I can't explain to my wife that the new equipment is to get the power amp off the top of the cabinet and into a shelf so that she can put whatever photos, knick knacks and ornaments she likes on top of the cabinet :-)