2. amps-preamps
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How important is the pre-amp?

Hello all,

Genuine request here for other's experiences.

I get how power amps can make really significant changes to the sound of a system. And of course speakers have an even bigger effect. And then there is the complicated relationship between the speaker and power amp. But I wonder about pre-amps.

In theory a well designed preamp should just act as a source switch and volume control. But does it add (or ruin) magic? Can a pre-amp color the sound? Alter pace and timing? Could you take a great sounding system and spoil it with the wrong preamp? Stereophile once gushed (while reviewing a preamp that cost as much as a car) that the preamp was the heart of the system, setting the tone of everything. Really? Some people don't even bother with a preamp, feeding their DACs straight into the power amp. Others favor passive devices, things without power. If one can get a perfectly good $2K preamp, why bother with 20K?

What your experiences been?
128x128rols
rols's avatar
rols OP
22 posts
 
Thank you all for the super interesting responses, just what I was hoping for.

I liked the point that a perfect preamp would do nothing to the sound, but what would it cost? Maybe my 1K preamp is far from what it could be. 

A general theme appeared to me that people found running without a preamp made their system sound a bit weak, undramatic. I had noticed this myself years ago, but thought that was just me. Now I have long interconnects (balanced) between pre and power so I can see that I need something to drive that cable.

I think my next treat will be a decent preamp. I am going to hunt around for one with a MC phono section but without an inboard DAC (as I think that technology is still changing fast, and I like the idea of keeping the digital stuff out of a mainly analog box). Something that feels classy to use (as the preamp is mainly what one touches). 

Thanks all for sharing. 
atmasphere's avatar
atmasphere
11,644 posts
 
Now I have long interconnects (balanced) between pre and power so I can see that I need something to drive that cable.
I don't know of a preamp that cost only $1000 that supports the balanced standard. Since you are driving long cables what you might consider is getting a set of Jensen transformers to sit at the output of the preamp and then have them drive the cables properly. You might be surprised at how well this can perform. You can do this with a single-ended preamp too.

I'm assuming that the amplifier has a balanced input. Its easier to build a balanced input that supports the standard than it is to build a preamp output section that does the same thing. So you may not need transformers at the input of the amp(s).

If you do try this, the output of any line transformer has to be loaded for best results. Jensen Transformers can advise you in this regard with their product, as should any manufacturer of a quality line transformer.
georgehifi's avatar
georgehifi
10,312 posts
 
Passives seem to have the edge with faster transients and a somewhat leaner sound.
We need a contribution here from georgehifi.

Back from holiday.
Look at it this way if "going direct", "going passive", "going active" all drive the amp/s perfectly, with no impedance or voltage restirictions.

The one that sounds closest to a piece of wire is the best, that’s the "direct" next best is the "passive", then the "active".
Going direct imitates a piece of wire with no colourations, next is passive, last is active as it has the most colourations/distortions.

Cheers George
atmasphere's avatar
atmasphere
11,644 posts
 
The one that sounds closest to a piece of wire is the best, that’s the "direct" next best is the "passive", then the "active".
As we all know from the existence of the high end cable industry, sounding like a 'piece of wire' might not be the way to go- since obviously different pieces of wire sound different- hence the cable industry.

The solution to preventing wires from sounding different, and getting rid of their artifact, is a technology that was originally developed for the telephone industry, but was rapidly adopted by the recording and broadcast industries in the early 1950s- the balanced line system, which is implemented with a set of standards. A passive volume control cannot support the balanced line standard, and so is less capable of being neutral.
roxy54's avatar
roxy54
7,793 posts
 
Check mate Ralph!
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