Where should the vocal image be?

@phusis +Exactly what you said about immediacy and presence! This is exactly what I look for in music reproduction!

I seek vocals emanating from head/mouth attached to body at natural height. Without this one can't have believable illusion of performers in room.

Add sense of presence and human size images together, what you get is involving listen.

The music comes  relatively to the recording, for me not  between the speakers...

Most of the times in almost good jazz or classical recording, the image has depth and is nor between the speakers , nor directly in front of me, but mostly like in an INTIMATE  headphone, BUT  OUT of my head filling the room and sometimes, relative to the recording beside me and in some rare case behind  my head...

ozzy62, Please point out where I "alluded". Or is this "allusion" an illusion of your delusion?

OP I hope you found a baseline from all this???????????

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Then if you want image focus and depth they need to be toed in quite a bit. The more toe in the deeper the stage.
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Well toe makes little difference in depth on my speakers.
The distance top back and side walls however make a lot of difference.

I suspect that the horizontal dispersion pattern has a role on toe needed?
Maybe those Moab’s need more than a good speakers requires?
(For the OP - It is definitely worth playing with the toe-in/toe-out though.)

Maybe 10-15 years ago I started moving the speakers around and go a magical spot where the sound was ~5 feet behind the wall.

Dragged the Mrs into the room, and she said she had never heard speakers sounding like they came from outside of the room, and also was distressed because she could not hear the speakers themselves as separate things.
She asked, “How does it work to make them sound like they are not there?”… I said, “It’s PFM”.