True or False?

The following is a common sentiment from some who claim to be audiophiles.

If you hear something but can’t measure it, you only think you heard a difference.

This notion is also common among people who claim to possess an accomplished understanding of audio, especially when achieving a high level of performance for a minimal investment.

So who’s right? On the one hand we have Objectivists who claim if you can’t measure it, you can’t possibly hear it or if you do, its expectation bias and self delusion. Are these people correct? Do they get as good as a sound, or better for far less money by ignoring cables, power cords, mechanical isolation, basically any accessory that many have found to dramatically improve performance despite a lack measurements? Do those who dismiss expensive digital to analog converters as being no better than rather common digital components with decent measurements get just as high a performance level as those of us with MSB and DCS? Do people who claim it’s all about finding perfect speaker placement, do these people outperform those of us with systems that cost multiples more than what they pay (Who also pay close attention to speaker placement as well as everything else)? Or do those of us who pay attention to cables— digital, analog, and power, what we set our components on top of, how we place our speakers, acoustics, and tweaks, expensive DACs and the like, do we get better sound? Who’s right? And how do we ultimately determine sound quality?

ted_denney01-23-2022 4:23pm

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mapman Details Discussions Posts This discussion Message User 22,182 posts 01-24-2022 at 03:20am Copy Comment URL Report Comment Edit Delete It’s not a contest between two extreme ideologies so the whole rambling OP is nonsense.
raysmtb1 Details Discussions Posts This discussion Message User 800 posts 01-24-2022 at 03:39am Copy Comment URL Report Comment Edit Delete What’s that old saying? Liars figure but figures don’t lie. Math is the only way to show that something is different. Everybody’s hearing is different by the equipment that things are measured on is neutral and doesn’t make things up. What’s that old saying? Liars figure but figures don’t lie. Math is the only way to show that something is different. Everybody’s hearing is different by the equipment that things are measured on is neutral and doesn’t make things up. The only thing that’s good about new expensive equipment is that generally the funds made from those products go more towards R&D budget than say a company that makes money on an expensive equipment that they sell a lot of. At least that’s the way I look at it. When I buy a new $7000 preamp the manufacture made it I know it’s going to come up with something even better a few years down the road. I don’t consider the idea I just stated applying to expensive enter K’NEX and power cards. I’m sorry but I can’t see you spending the same amount of money on cords as the entire frame cost. That’s just called getting ripped off
tomic601 Details Discussions Posts This discussion Message User 12,911 posts 01-24-2022 at 03:51am Copy Comment URL Report Comment Edit Delete funny how my collection of now ancient ( like me ) German microphones were conceived, designed and made by Measure AND Listen dudes…… My recording studio mentor says pick a microphone pick a flavor….one flavor is heavy murk, some people like it…. Carry on !
holmz Details Discussions Posts This discussion Message User 2,328 posts 01-24-2022 at 04:04am Copy Comment URL Report Comment Edit Delete You guys prattling on about measurements, did you actually read my original post? Or is this just a reflexive, triggered reaction? The question isn’t measurements versus no measurements, or anti-measurement. The question is, do people who do everything, acoustics, measurements, and things like cables, accessories and higher end electronics for which there is not a sophomoric suite of measurements that prove anything, do we get better sound when we pay attention to everything versus guys who only address what can be measured and ignore everything else? There were 8 question marks in the OP, excluding the one in the title. That sort of concise literary rigour, sort of gets a tapas plate of responses.
cakyol Details Discussions Posts This discussion Message User 940 posts 01-24-2022 at 04:26am Copy Comment URL Report Comment Edit Delete Double blind tests prove otherwise, almost always in favor of the measurement crowd.