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What is the added value of a streamer over a networked dedicated Computer

Hi

I see lots of sales pitches for streamers as digital sources, and plenty on this site advocating them. I get that they're a purpose-built user interface but, apart from that convenience, including a visual display on the device, (i) do they really deliver better hi-fi sound as a source over a well set up computer dedicated to hi-fibreoriduction (ii) if so, why?

Here's some background to my question(s). I currently use a dedicated Mac Mini with SSD (headlessly) and Audirvana Plus software through a USB DAC. I tend to listen to digital files on external drives (wired connections). Some are high Definition eg Flac, some are aiff ripped from my extensive CD collection. Currently I only tend to use Spotify etc to test if I like music and invest in actual downloads of the music I like.  In day to day use the Mac Mini/Audirvana Plus (virtual) player is controlled using its remote app on an iPad on the same Network. If I wanted I could add high quality online streaming from, eg, Tidal. Whilst that would expand the breadth of music I have immediate access to, it seems to me to add another potential source of interruption/corruption of data flow. The Audirvana software overrides/bypasses detrimental computer audio elements and processes keeping the data path simple and dedicated to hifi audio replay.

So what, sound quality-wise, would a standalone streamer device using NAS or other drive storage and/or online web connection bring to the party? It seems to me it's just a digital device containing effectively the components of a computer with a button (or remote) interface. I understand the old argument that it's dedicated and not doing other things simultaneously and that computers are traditionally electrically noisy environments but I'm currently sceptical that with a dedicated computer, not being used for other purposes, and running a virtual device like Audirvana Plus which effectively switches off internal functions which might compromise sound, this is a real problem. Also it seems that a "dedicated streamer" contains many elements which are effectively computing elements. Note that I have no industry connection or monetary interest from Audirvana or Apple.

128x128napoleoninrags16
spenav
414 posts
 

@napoleoninrags16 

 

I had the same setup some years back. My mini was optimized with SSD and a better power cable, also the software was trimmed to eliminate all unnecessary processes. I enjoyed the hell out of it for a while. Then I got a Melco server/streamer. Everything got cleaner. The resolution was better, the soundstage and instrument separation were also better. The mini was no match. Still, one can live with the mini if it is implemented and setup right and upgrade when ready. If the Melco is a 10, the mini was a 7. 

yage
399 posts
 

@napoleoninrags16

You’re on the right track. As long as the digital data is getting to your DAC intact, there’s no reason to get a ’better’ streamer. It’s already doing the job it needs to do.

 

Jitter isn’t much of an issue. For example, most USB interfaces simply drop data packets if the data stream has too much jitter / error and this will manifest itself as an interruption in playback. If you’re using another digital interface like coax SPDIF or optical, large amounts of jitter will contribute distortion to the signal. If you want to hear what that actually sounds like, here’s a link - Let’s listen to some jitter simulations. Similarly, here’s what an underperforming digital interface sounds like (e.g. not enough jitter / error to cause a dropout).

 

Noise is another supposed bugaboo. Guess what? If you don’t hear any noise when your system is turned on and set to the volume you listen to, then it’s not a problem.

 

Digital signals are actually very robust. Think about it this way - if digital signals were fragile, how would the astronauts in the ISS be able to get a 600 Mb connection? How would people be able to stream audio or video from a service that stores the files in servers (which incidentally were probably also copied over a digital network) that are hundreds of miles away?

ghdprentice
6,382 posts
 

Yes. A high quality stand alone streamer will provide very large sonic improvements. 
 

I experimented for years with PCs and my Mac laptop… running on battery with most software shut down, with files in different places.

 

Then I got my first stand alone streamer: Aurlic Aries g2. That in a couple minutes put an end to my resistance to spending a lot of money on what amounts to a computer that looks like audio equipment. The question was dead. No more computers in my signal train. I then worked systematically from the bottom of the Aurender to the very top… and my system is now sonically the same as my great analog side.

Experience completely shut down any logical arguments in my mind. I have reasons I think for the difference… but the proof is in the sound quality. I now listen to streaming 95% of the time. 

gregm
3,395 posts
 

What @ghdprentice said above. 

Also had a mac running audirvana, etc, etc. Identical results. Good luck!

 

12many
221 posts
 

@yage

I think Yage is on the right track. If the digital data is getting to your DAC and accurately represents the intended song data digital bits should be the same.   Assuming you have a properly functioning dedicated streamer and separate dedicated DAC of good quality - let’s say $500 and over for just the streamer and using wired connection and properly functioning cables, a digital 1 is a digital 1 and a digital 0 is a digital 0. DAC will have differences though. Properly functioning devices correct jitter and Ethernet has error correcting / FEC built in. I know people say they can hear the difference, and that is great and I don't think they are lying, but technically, I don’t know of any reason why some digital bits are better. I would like to see a comparison of the digital data after receipt and processing the the DAC USB to compare the bits between streamers. I always have an open mind.

That being said, computers and their OS tend to be difficult to get working properly, PC’s seem to be the worst. I have read the OS can resample the signal or the digital output of some motherboards can be really bad. I had a USB port on a motherboard once that could barely function for data I/O. You should try a good quality wire connected streamer and see if you can hear a difference. That is the real test, and be sure to let us know.

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