Audio Science Review = "The better the measurement, the better the sound" philosophy


"Audiophiles are Snobs"  Youtube features an idiot!  He states, with no equivocation,  that $5,000 and $10,000 speakers sound equally good and a $500 and $5,000 integrated amp sound equally good.  He is either deaf or a liar or both! 

There is a site filled with posters like him called Audio Science Review.  If a reasonable person posts, they immediately tear him down, using selected words and/or sentences from the reasonable poster as100% proof that the audiophile is dumb and stupid with his money. They also occasionally state that the high end audio equipment/cable/tweak sellers are criminals who commit fraud on the public.  They often state that if something scientifically measures better, then it sounds better.   They give no credence to unmeasurable sound factors like PRAT and Ambiance.   Some of the posters music choices range from rap to hip hop and anything pop oriented created in the past from 1995.  

Have any of audiogon (or any other reasonable audio forum site) posters encountered this horrible group of miscreants?  

fleschler

As for the other thread about audioquest this is what I said and how you replied:

kota1 said:

Don't ever spend your cash on anyone elses evidence, just form your own evidence though auditioning gear and by using retrun polices, NP.

I really feel sorry for folks like you. Instead of sitting back and enjoying music, you keep worrying about the most mundane things like how your wires sound! Learn to take some things for granted. You know, like how you don't worry about the bolts that are holding your engine together while driving. Base your audio decisions on science and engineering and you become free of such anguish.

I suspect it won't be long until folks like you worry about your sock color impacting the sound you hear.....

Let's see if I have this right, amir_asr has purely altruistic motives for reviewing and measuring equipment.  He has no credentials that I have seen for test and measuring nor has he shown any type of equipment certification.  If I am wrong, now is the time to show that.  I'm calling nonsense on this.  No one does something for nothing.  Whether he is feeding his ego gaining notoriety through controversy or is making a good sum of cash, he has a motive.  The fact that he himself admitted  he would not report on a $20,000 DAC that he claims had a flaw seems to go against his very agenda.  Are not all of his followers now at risk of spending their money on this flawed DAC?  It would seem that his own moral standards have been compromised by accepting equipment from manufacturers to test at no cost. That is different from testing other peoples equipment for them that they own.

Amir_asr makes some generalizations about, "audiophiles" that is not correct.

1)  He says that we audio hobbyists in general cannot hear the difference in sound of various gear.  And he has test data to prove it.  I call that nonsense.

The people in this hobby and on this forum can hear enough of a difference to be willing to invest their time and money into it.  Many of the persons here benchmark their systems to live sound either/both outdoors and inside concert halls.  Many of us play musical instruments and therefore look for recreating that live sound in our listening rooms.  If generalizing that most stereo gear sounds the same albeit cables, DACs, speakers or amps across price points then musicians must be deluded to prefer a specific more expensive instrument over a more basic, cheaper alternative.

2)  He seems to think that the people on this forum, with the exception of the trolls and flamers are naive and have too much money to spend on gear.  I call that nonsense.

Most on this forum are well moneyed, motivated and successful people with a desire to reproduce music as accurately and enjoyably as possible.  The idea that these type of people check their brains at the door and buy the most expensive, shiny noise making baubles they can afford is ludicrous.  Most on these forums are skeptical and require verification of genuineness, value and reliability/customer support before buying.

The point of these forums is to help buyers beware.  Plenty of accredited journals exist to review and assess the latest technology and offerings.  Now and then a manufacturer comes along and tries to pull a fast one on the buying public.  They don't last long.  Enough people on these forums as well as the industry in general have the ability and influence to put a stop to shams.

Over the years I have seen a lot of "giant killer" companies come and go,  or the ones that survive eventually improve and develop a reputation for their products.  Reputation is everything in any business.  Sure, many will always go for that promise of gold for the price of straw but those companies quickly run out of customers.

Amir_asr has the promise of uncovering bogus gear but falls short in terms of objectivity and fairness.  Fairness in terms of accepting that people can hear more than that can be measured.  Fairness in being able to counter a conclusion or debate it without a character assignation attack.

@tonywinga Plenty of accredited journals exist to review and assess the latest technology and offerings.

Name a few of these accredited journals.  Include their accreditation status by the appropriate body.

I don't think a healthy, civilized society like AG should censor / ban amir or any person like him as asr / amir did to others.  But we could choose to ignore him simply because you could not win the argument with a dictator from a third-world community like putin.  His seemingly non-toxic statements filled with toxic tone / attitude should always be ignored.

@rudyb +2

As long as measurements are not brought upon us as better or worse ’sound quality’ and as long as subjective hearing is not brought upon us as a fact, maybe we can all appreciate each others measurements and opinions and live peacefully together?

Another simple but yet insightful observation - thank you.

I appreciate that @amir_asr has shown up amidst the noxious climate of this thread to respond to the many inflammatory statements.  I don't need to believe or refute the information provided on ASR, but I can learn from it while abiding by their rules.  For those who can get past the concept that everyone doesn't need to agree or think the same, diversity can be interesting and insightful especially when delivered with civility.