Discuss The Viv Lab Rigid Arm

@cleeds , Like @raulirugas said, what you think you hear is meaningless. I include myself in that category. With issues like this science always knows best. Everything else is alchemy. I have made my own missteps in the past and have learned not to buck the reality of the situation. Viv owners seem not to understand that reality and that they have been taken advantage knowingly or not by the purveyors of snake oil. There is a sucker born every minute and I have to admit I have been suckered plenty. In order to be old and wise you have to be suckered a lot.

@ pindac, like I said above there is a sucker born every minute. Consumer beware.

" A bose radio can sound good to some people." 

There is no such thing as a perfect tonearm. Each one has a slew of compromises which should be aimed at minimizing all significant sources of distortion in a balanced way. The offset pivoted tonearm with anti skating is the solution scientists came up with over a period of 100 years and most of the work was done 90 years ago. In state of the art systems the sonic benefits of this design executed intelligently are obvious. My suggestion to those Viv owners who are looking for the best sound quality is to suck it up and get rid of that arm. That it sounds good to some people is meaningless. 

@rauliruegas , you may not be so hot typing English but there can be no doubt you know how to read it :-) 

@mijostyn Ague your point and make all the analogies required to get your point across, I don't see it being heeded, iif a individual has their mind set on experiencing a device they will.

If such a experience has proven more satisfying through demonstration, than a design that has aligned itself to minimising a host of Mechanical and Geometry concerns as being presented within this thread, it is looking quite likely the most satisfying option is to become a priority pursuit. When looking at the Tonearms now being reported on, as less preferred, even superseded, by the Viv Lab Arm, it is going to take a lot more than futile Argument or fanciful Analogies to steer one to the course being proposed by yourself.

It looks like, from my perspective a enjoyment has been discovered and is one worthy of maintaining, which pretty much suggests the entertainment factor of listening to recorded music is being met. Who has a goal that does not include that?

Raul, thank you for the long post in which you quoted an analysis of the classical tonearm geometry and the reasons for it. Now would you be so kind as to post the source of the technical section that you seem to have cut and pasted into the audiogon forum website? I would like to access it, because it frequently refers to data and figures which of necessity are not included in your post. The mathematics are very hard to follow without access to the supportive data. I am very interested to read the article in detail. Thanks a lot. 

@pindac has hit the nail on the head surely the point is the enjoyment of music.

I don't know about anyone else but when I buy a new piece of equipment I don't give a stuff about the theories, the equations, the technical specifications, the measured performance etc, all I am interested in is does it engage me in the music more that the piece of equipment it is replacing, whilst still fulfilling the usual hifi criteria. If it ticks these boxes then funds permitting I buy it.

This is exactly what the Viv Labs did and why I bought it over a Kuzma 4point, Kuzma 313ref.

So I say to @rauliruegas ​​​and @mijostyn if you get the opportunity please have an objective listen to a Viv Labs and put all the theories, equations etc to one side. If it doesn't float your boat then fine.

Please do not try to say those people who have bought a Viv Labs and are enjoying it have been taken advantage of and that the retailer's are purveyors of snake oil, as that is just patronising and derogatory, which I would have hoped was beneath you, but obviously not.

Agree with those that say "just listen" and then tell us your thoughts. I’ve never heard a Viv tonearm or even seen one in the wild but it does look interesting. Many people said that Kuzma’s new SAFIR tonearm that has a mass of 60 gms would NEVER work either. (Kuzma says is suitable for cartridges with CU below 25 and hence the tonearm resonance will be in range of 5-7 Hz which is preferable) But I was sent one to have a listen to and all I can say is WOW! Never heard a tonearm that sounded like no other before, it was like the cartridge was just riding in the grooves of the LP. I had no intensions of buying it but once heard it wasn’t going anywhere.

(Dealer disclaimer)