Okay......best single box reference CD player

Some ultra-premium manufacturers, such as Zanden, and Naim (for their CD555 and CDS3 player), use legacy chips that are no longer made. Whether they are charging more because of this, or for any other reason, it is hard to say. But, a manufacturer that uses such chips must factor in their scarcity, and must limit production because some parts have to be held in reserve for repairs and servicing the product for years to come.

By the way, the Audionote DAC-5, which uses "primitive" technology is, to me, one of the very best DACs on the market. I also agree with Bar81 that a GNSC-modified Wadia is no slouch when compared to just about anything out there.

Guys, I'll withhold judgment on sonic merits of specific high end players until I do some more listening, but I must confess all the talk about some of these vendors using older, scarce chips is a big red warning flag to me.

If I drop a small fortune on a player, I want to be assured that parts exist and it can be kept running indefinitely. I would probably also expect a pretty decent warranty?

Also, I've noticed that many recent ultra high end players listed here on Agon seem to go for much less than originally paid for whatever reason, so rationally, one must factor depreciation into the buying equation as well.

Mapman,

The issue of parts goes well beyond just those using no-longer-manufactured parts. Production of current parts can end with little or no warning. That has particularly been the case with transport mechanisms for players. Your best bet, as far as such concerns go, is to stick with a manufacturer that has been around a long time that has a good reputation. Such manufacturers will keep enough parts around to service their products for a while.

I can see why a lot of people are reluctant to put a lot of money into gear that can become unserviceable. That happens with other electronics too, particularly solid state amplifiers using output transistors that cannot be readily substituted with other off the shelf transistors or vintage transistors that are in big supply.

I agree with Larryi, as quite a few high end units use older out of production DAC chips. For instance, Esoteric, Naim, Muse, Zanden, Lector, & Empirical Audio all use the older Burr Brown 1704 in at least one of their current production units, and Charles Hansen of Ayre had mentioned how much he likes it as well, but cannot obtain them anymore. In the DACS that I have listened to, I also prefer this older chip which is why I researched this in the first place. That says nothing of course on how well the unit that uses the chip is designed, which may or may not be better with more recently designed gear.

i suppose it is hard to isolate performance to just the DAC; but i do think that my perception of the performance advances of the Playback Designs is likely due a great deal to it's unique DAC design.

the DAC in the Playback Designs MPS-5 has an open architecture; it can be 1 bit-5.6mhz or 32 bit-196mhz, 72 bit-496 mhz or anything they want it to be. thru the USB port the software can be updated to whatever they want. algorithms can be updated.

this approach; properly implimented.....would likely trump any older set of 'off-the-shelf' dac chips. and would also be likely to stay at the top level of performance longer since it can be upgraded thru software.

the challenge, of course, is 'properly implimented'.