why expensive streamers


@soix and others

I am unclear about the effect on sound of streamers (prior to getting to the dac). Audio (even hi-res) has so little information content relative to the mega and giga bit communication and processing speeds (bandwidth, BW) and cheap buffering supported by modern electronics that it seems that any relatively cheap piece of electronics would never lose an audio bit. 

Here is why. Because of the huge amount of BW relative to the BW needs of audio, you can send the same audio chunk 100 times and use a bit checking algorithm (they call this "check sum") to make sure just one of these sets is correct. With this approach you would be assured that the correct bits would be transfered. This high accuracy rate would mean perfect audio bit transfer. 

What am I missing? Why are people spending 1000's on streamers?

thx

 

128x128delmatae

mdalton

those are called rhetorical questions ...

I apologize if my frustration came across as hostile.  

Sealioning, anyone?

@cleeds 

Geez, the second comment was an apology for the first.  Doesn’t anyone even accept apologies anymore? 

@mitch2 

To me, the issue is not whether there’s no jitter, it’s whether there’s a substantial difference in jitter across streamers, how much jitter we’re talking about, and the extent to which different DACs reject jitter from streamers.

As I’ve previously indicated, I have found the “lab report” section of HiFi News streamer reviews incredibly insightful.  I’ve looked at the results from 10 different streamer reviews over about 4 years; in 5 of them they use a usb connection to a computer as their control scenario vs. the streamer, and then they use up to 3 different DACs with both the computer and the streamer.  All 10 of the reviews I’ve pulled feature the Mytek Brooklyn dac, 6 include the iFi Neo iDSD, and 4 include the AQ Dragonfly.  Here are some takeaways:

1) The Mytek has low jitter levels itself, and also is very effective at rejecting any streamer-induced jitter;

2) The iFi is a low jitter DAC, but is not nearly as effective at rejecting streamer-induced jitter; and 

3) The amount of jitter produced by all 10 of the streamers, priced from £1k to £25k, is very low, and doesn’t vary materially by price.

How did I arrive  at these conclusions?  Here are several snippets of the data:

- the single highest jitter number, 550 psec, was with the computer/iFi combo, substantially more than the computer/Dragonfly number (300 psec).

- but, when paired with a decent streamer (e.g., the Volumio Riva or Aurender N200), the iFi’s jitter amount was substantially less than the Dragonfly (18 & 9 psec v. 150 & 135 psec, respectively.

- the Mytek’s jitter levels were never above 10 psec, whether using the computer or one of the 10 streamers.  

So while a decent DAC, in this case the iFi, may not be engineered to reject jitter from a streamer, you don’t need to spend much to have a very low-jitter streamer.  That’s why a Raspberry Pi can sound so good - many DACs, even moderately priced, do a good job of rejecting jitter from a streamer.  But to be safe, you can invest a little more than $150 and get a very low-jitter streamer.  

 

 

I feel like there needs to be some consequences when audiophile companies rip off rich people and the hobby they love.