Adding tube sound to my SS system


I have a question for the hive mind. I had the opportunity try a PS Audio BHK tube preamp in my system the other day (in between my LUMIN T2 and Luxman 509x bypassing the luxman preamp) and the vocals / midrange made my heart flutter and chills run up my spine. I heard life detail and nuance in the vocals that I didn’t with the Luxman preamp and sounded like the singer was in the room. But, it was lacking in soundstage, bass and so so recordings didn’t shine. The Luxman preamp made everything sound smoother and liquid but at the expense of some life in the midrange. I ultimately liked the sound without the BHK preamp better, But, that tube sound is intriguing and I’m looking for a way to add it into my system.

system is LUMIN T2->Luxman l509x->spendor D9.2

I keep the Luxman loudness on all the time. Maybe that says I like a fuller sound. i stream 99% of the time through Roon or airplay (tidal and my wife uses Spotify). The modern convenience of controlling volume from the phone is essential (this the LUMIN). Home theater runs through the HT bypass on the luxman. All kinds of music jazz, folk, rock, hip hop etc. simplicity has value over going fully separates. I’ve been trying to research streaming dacs that have a tube or streaming tube preamps but not really having any luck finding anything that fits the bill. Looking to upgrade the LUMIN as I love the aesthetic of the Luxman so it would be hard to part with but I’d do it if needed. Wondering if streamer to tube preamp to power amp is the only way to make it work. Budget is not too much more than my current gear and willing to buy used.

128x128trentgordon

https://tmraudio.com/components/preamplifiers/modwright-analog-bridge-tube-buffer/

@jbuhl  Yep - the "Analog Bridge" by ModWright is a fantastic suggestion for OP that shouldn't get buried. And Dan Wright is truly a great guy. I almost picked up one myself, but I'm such a gear hoarder and already have so many tube components - I'm not sure I have a use case for it yet. Seems perfect for OP to try. 

A lot of tube preamps use something like an Alps RK27 pot (aka "Blue Velvet", or its motorized version), which always audibly penalizes sound quality (even if slightly) whenever I've compared it to other alternatives. Even up to very high MSRP's, you see that ubiquitous blue plastic pot all too often. I hate it! I absolutely hate the Alps Blue. I can't understate that. In general, the volume control is often a weak point of the tube preamp. The Bridge avoids that issue.

I was running a Rogue RP-7 tube preamp into a highly-regarded Rogue tube power amp, the power amp replacing a SS amp driving my Fyne Audio F-702 speakers that were made in Scotland.  I felt it resulted in degraded tonal qualities of instruments, reduced definition, and slightly reduced soundstage.  I replaced the tube power amp—but kept the tube preamp—with a pair of Odyssey SS monobloc amps, and I have regained what I lost plus gained better imaging and depth and lateral dispersion of soundstage. 

@mike4597 Most of the Rogue power amps (I had Apollo Darks) do not sound like traditional tubes. And the RP-9 didn't sound even *slightly* like a tube preamp to me (like the RP-7, it's actually a hybrid). I've had Solid State amps that are actually "sweeter" sounding. Glad you found what works in your system! Nice speakers.

I agree with @soix and others about maybe changing up the DAC.  I know this is a different direction than going down the tube path but a ladder DAC (R2R) might get you moving towards the sound you're looking for.  There are lots of options that would pair with the level of equipment you are running.  I would research which of the R2R DACs have the warmest presentation since that's what you're chasing.  Good luck and cheers.

I was going to suggest a Foz SSX but @dtorc beat me to it. This little gizmo definitely has an effect on the sound. I use one in my desktop system and the stereo width and bass features are very nice. I've hooked it up into my main system (Krell/Thiel) and I decided that I preferred the sound without it.

The other thing I've tried is the Yaqin SD-CD3 tube buffer. I have this in the tape loop of my main system which is a great way to compare the sound with it and without it. It makes a very subtle difference in my system but YMMV.

Both of these units are relatively inexpensive and can be a low cost way to test the effect of tubes in your electronics chain.

Thanks everyone for the suggestions and thoughts!  Seems like changing the DAC or trying the Modwright tube buffer are great options without starting from scratch. On the search now for a tube or r2r dac that allows me to control volume from within Roon but not having much luck.  Might be asking too much here...  

I know the Rockna Waelight is going to have a bluetooth based volume control you can run off your phone.  I am not sure if it integrates within Roon but it may.  I am one of the Rockna dealers in the US.  I have wavedreams open right now but not the wavelight.