Anyone else excited for this Borresen subwoofer?!!!


It seems quite unique...(as one might expect from Michael B).

Borresen Subwoofer - Michael Borresen Interview

 

 

deep_333

Those Rythmik drivers are pretty well built, better than a lot of pro sound drivers. I can’t see the idea the servo is just making up for cheap or inadequate drivers. Mine get plenty loud enough. I’m not looking to ruin my hearing, so plenty adequate probably for most anyone in a home setup. 

@deep_333 I am deep into control systems. I have been using room control and digital bass management since 1996 not to mention I design and build my own subwoofers. One of today’s excellent low distortion subwoofer drivers 12" and larger, used in adequate quantities for the environment have no need for servo anything.

@mijostyn Get the highest quality low distortion driver you want...It is still unrelated to the principles behind servo control. You are still asking an accelerated mass to stop passively/ring down without it, which may be good enough with a high quality driver. You are actively stopping it with servo control by letting it constantly track a setpoint.

@phusis Paul’s vid describes the free lunch that he got with initial use of crappy drivers. How about this....Get the low distortion high excursion bells and whistles driver. Now, stack/integrate several of them so they don’t have to move as much for said spl level. Now, add servo control on top of it...it is incremental. It could all be overkill at normal listening levels, but, maybe not, because it is still the highest distortion component in the chain, relatively speaking.

On a related note, I have some coupled cavity speakers, i.e. the physical bass drivers sit inside and are cavity coupled to external radiators (Acoustic filter/ clean bass). One might argue that it is a unnecessarily complicated design. But, the free-er lunch there was that you didn’t need very expensive drivers trying to hit a price point (the expensive driver that may or may not hit a performance requirement just because you kept spending up the wrong tree). I know because i also owned a cost no object conventional speaker design from that same designer...a few different ways to do these things/clean it up, i suppose.

 

@deep_333 You are not understanding the physics of the situation deep. A powerful amp with a very low output impedance completely controls to motion of a well designed subwoofer driver. Music (sound) is not a series of stop and go traffic  lights. It is a conglomeration of sine waves. As soon as the cone passes the equilibrium point it starts decelerating gradually until it passes the zenith then it accelerates toward the equilibrium point again. The cone never stops, it just changes direction all under control of the amplifier and powerful magnets. Subwoofers do need help in other areas to provide that "you are there" intensity of a live performance, but servo control is not one of them. I owned a pair of Velodynes once. One of them is serving as a base for a fish tank. 

@deep_333 You are not understanding the physics of the situation deep. A powerful amp with a very low output impedance completely controls to motion of a well designed subwoofer driver.

@mijostyn , We can actually obtain high fidelity measurements (track the driver) and compare with instrumentation used typically in other fields of engg ....how well it was controlled or not....any driver+amp or a servo based system (LVDT, or a series of high sensitivity mini accels, conditioners and a DAQuisition system).

Until then, you could never be sure...

@deep_333  For example, a servo controlled driver will be forced to slam STOP quicker than some floppy/sloppy driver. It will result in the perception of FAST BASS! There may be other ways to do it as well. What is so hard about this to comprehend?

Oops, I didn't mean to criticize the ability of servo control rather the basic premise of the term subwoofer speed. I write poorly, my bad. "sloppy / floppy" that I'm going to use, thanks.

 

I replaced the Octavium with my first servo sub in the late 70's from Jonas Miller and Ken Kreisel at their Wilshire Blvd store. They had a stunning with and without demonstration setup there.

Now that I understood I was listening for I heard an even better presentation when I brought home Velodyne's ULD servo design and currently use two DD Plus. That David Hall, smart guy.

I believe the sub in my large Bag End ELF-M / S18E-D Bass rig has some control associated.