Schroeder vs. Triplanar VII Sonic Differences

Sirspeedy,

Although I don't think this is an issue (see below), the one disadvantage in adjusting VTF on a Schroeder is that minor changes in azimuth may arise since they are controlled by the same mechanism. This isn't the case with the Triplanar since VTF and Azimuth are controlled by separate mechanical mechanisms.

I'm not sure how much of an issue this is. Ultimately the excellent sonic signature of the Schroeder arm will likely greatly outweigh a minor shortcoming like this. I have nothing but awe about the Schroeder. There are adjustment pro's and con's with any arm. Some are certainly better than others in this regard. The Graham just to name one seems like a great arm in terms of adjustment.

Everyone has a diffiernt level of patience to dial an arm in perfectly. Thoms' comments made earlier speak to this perfectly. I for one am willing to take the "trouble" to ultimately achieve top performance.

I suspect that an arm's basic sonic signature will shine through and overide the end result despite being slightly off optimum settings.

I should probably get to sleep already but I wanted to address an obvious question you all probably have based on my previous post since you may detect a contrdiction based on my final choice of the Triplanar. Especially after a comment like "I for one would go through the trouble ( of pain staking adjustment) to achieve optimum performance". The question being, why didn't I go with the Schroeder despite the more difficult adjustment process. Let me explain:

Firstly, since this was my first arm, I was a bit intimidated by the importance of adjustment difficulty prior to my selection . Therefore, the ease of adjustment the Triplanar offered was more appealing at the time.

Secondly, the Triplanar is highly regarded and seems to suit my musical tastes. Rock n Roll. I like speed, dynamics, detail and excellent bass.

Thirdly, my budget at the time of purchase combined with the long wait did not allow me to buy the Schroeder Reference which is supposed to offer these musical qualities in addition to my other priorities which are instrument and vocal timbre and soundstaging. The DPS and Model 2 supposedly do not offer this full combination to the extent of the Reference.

Now that I have played around with adjustments parameters, I've found that they do not make night and day differences. Minor deviations around an optimum are swamped by the arm's sonic signature. The only disclaimer is that I'm using a cheap cartrdge. A better cartridge may be more sensitive. As well, dialing in the adjustment is not rocket science. Not to belittle the point.

Therefore, I am now less intimidated and would be more comfortable with the adjustment dififuclties of a Schroeder. Ultimately, I plan to compare the Reference to the Triplanar, adjustment difficulty aside, and make a call based on sonic virtues. By that time, funds may be available to purchase the Reference if it suits my muscial tastes better.

I'm not trying to short change the Triplanar the least bit. It is an excellent sounding arm! For those that do not want to take a lot of time/trouble dialing in an arm and require easy VTF adjsutment, without messing with azimuth, and easy VTA adjustment with exclellent sound to boot then the Triplanar is a great choice.

Sonic qualities aside, I guess my point is that the Triplanar is probably more appealing to the folks that are not as comfortable with the time and level of expertise in maximizing an arm's performance. The Reference is probably more suited to folks with mechanical dexterity and patience.

Going to sleep now since it's 1AM! My new interest in Analog has been keeping me way past my beadtime. I haven't listened to a CD in three days.

By the way, my name is Andrew. It may be easier to address me as such than typing my first initial and last name.

Goodnight. Try not to dream about Schroeders and Triplanar's too much!

Hello Aoliviero,
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All Schroeder arms can be ordered with a VTF fine tuning "screw" that allows making minute changes without altering any other parameter.
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Once you're in the ballpark of the recommended/desired VTF, turning a knurled wheel that is situated in the end stub(No.2) or the counterweight (DPS & Reference) will shift enough mass to account for a VTF change of 0.02 grams per revolution.
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As for Thomas Heisig’s comment on the SQ version of the Reference, I'd like to know from where he gets his information. Suffice it to say that neither the quoted price difference nor the differentiating features have been represented accurately.
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Kha(hello!) had the opportunity to hear the SQ version at the AAA Frankfurt show in early March. The Ref. SQ (with Dynavector XV-1s) was mounted on a TW Acoustic Raven AC aside a Tri-Planar MkVII (+Eminent, My Sonic Lab) , a Da Vinci Grandezza (+Dyna TeKaitora) and a Jelco arm (+Denon 103R).
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As the combinations (that includes the choice of phono stages: Pass XONO, Klyne, Tron Seven, Whest) were chosen by the designer of the turntable(Thomas Woschnik) for the best mechanical, electrical and sonic match(your choices might be different :-), it should be interesting for the participants of this thread to hear Kha’s impressions of the comparisons that were done.
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Those who have any questions regarding the SQ version can contact me privately after April the 6th(I'm currently abroad with infrequent access to the net, sorry).

Best Regards,
Frank

Frank,

Thank you for highlighting that feature. Forgot about that one. Sorry. Any chance of giving us a brief summary of the SQ version?

Kha,

Any comments on the TT/cartidge comparison Frank is referring to.

A further thought. I keep referring to the adjustment differences between these arms as difficult or easy. The more I think about it, the more this seems like the wrong terminology. Once again, I refer you to Thom's comments earlier in the thread. I was basically trying to decribe exactly this point just earlier. Never mind my rambling's, here is Thom's comment:

"I'd add only one thing to Doug's comments - something I make a point of emphasizing to everyone who asks me about these arms.

I've noticed that different people relate to or interact differently with each of the tonearms. Some find the Schröder to be easier to set up, while others relate better to the Triplanar. Both arms are straight-forward however.

Because Frank's arm is so innovative, the user will most definitely benefit from a guided tour, but this is not to say that it is difficult any more than the Triplanar is.

I think setup should factor strongly into the decision, because the arm that you interact with best is the arm you will set up best, and guess what? They are both so good, that the one you set up best will be ... you guessed it ... the best ... at least as far as you are concerned, which is all that matters"

Andrew

PS, when will Audiogon get a spell-checker?