Is Direct Drive Really Better?


I've been reading and hearing more and more about the superiority of direct drive because it drives the platter rather than dragging it along by belt. It actually makes some sense if you think about cars. Belt drives rely on momentum from a heavy platter to cruise through tight spots. Direct drive actually powers the platter. Opinions?
macrojack
Let's all pray you will have the time Fernando. Just use your time for more profitable pursuits.
Dear Zaikesman: +++++ " There could be others, " +++++

I agree but that is not the point.

+++++ " The status quo however is that turntable reviews (and cartridge and tonearm reviews) include no measured test results whatsoever. This is unfortunate, because I believe there can be a salutory effect on the product marketplace stemming from public accountability for technical performance claims and the availability of comparison data. " +++++

I agree too. We need a come back to " Audio magazin e "!!!!

++++ " It might be interesting if Teres would be willing to share with us some idea of what kinds of measurements are taken as part of a manufacturer's design and testing process that aren't normally published for consumer consumption. " +++++

Yes, it will be interesting and not only from Teres but for other designers like Walker ( Rushton, Albert: Can you help about? ). Btw, for what I read about the Walker TT, including the very long and very interesting review-interview in 6Moons ( I think ), Mr. Walker never mentioned any Proscenium measurements ( top secret? ): Albert-Mike-Rushton, do you know if something exist about?.

Btw, I will be really surprised if those measurements exist not only from Walker but from other TT manufacturers and here I will be very happy to be wrong.

Regards and enjoy the music.
Raul.
Dear TWL: +++++ " And that also includes the price range, because if a listener cannot afford it, it is of little consequence to him how great it may be. " +++++

I totally agree. The price subject is really important for all of us and to have a different point of view about TTs: how much we need to paid for almost the same quality on a DD and BD system?

If we take a look, only with the " numbers/specs " that we have on hand, it seems to me that the BD system is more expensive than the DD systems ( other than Rockport ). We can have a SP10 for 400.00 with out base/tonearm !!!!!!!!

I can put on a contest one of my Sp 10s ( against any BD one ) where I invest around: 2K, this include: Sp 10, marble base, Pneumatic Audio technica footers, Vacuum Audio Technica platter, mods on the external power supply, tonearm, tiptoe like between the SP 10 and the marble base, etc, etc. This TT could be a " sound surprise " for many of us.

Regards and enjoy the music.
Raul.
I would like to add my two cents to this forum for it seems to me there is an important assumption that is overlooked in the discussion. The assumption is that all people have (more or less) the same pitch sensitivity. So much so that we (audiophiles) can rely on each others’ experience and opinions whether a certain design is pitch accurate or not. Well, from my experience, audiophiles are less reliable than other people in noticing pitch problems (and, more generally, wow and flutter). I could try to explain this phenomenon but this is not my concern here. My concern here is only to say that when people claim that belt drive is better or worst than DD or idler wheel, they either rely on theory or on their own ears, and neither should be trusted too much. I have seen it happen that a group of audiophiles were so impressed with the resolution of a system, its dynamic impact or its huge soundstage, that the fact that the turntable was completely off pitch evaded their notice. This is why I think that at least in this department, measurements are mandatory (although people should also take heed of the fact that measurements are done on test records, not what we actually listen to).

The problem is made worse by the fact that there is another factor which affects wow and flutter: the compliance of arm and cartridge, and also, (what I have learned only recently), the vibrations coming from the turntable. So perfect speed stability of turntable might not be enough.

Now from my experience, belt drives do indeed have pitch problems, but some more than others. For example, I have a suspicion that some of the pitch problems I have had with my Nottingham Analogue Space-Deck are due to its LONG belt (people who are saying the NA is accurate notwithstanding since I have heard the same problems at my local dealer’s showroom). Shorter belt designs, like Linn and Rega, might have an advantage here, in my view, but this is theory so take it with a grain of salt. My experience, on the other hand, with the Rega showed it had a serious pitch problem whereas the only Linn I have heard was hooked to the Lingo, and it sounded quite accurate, as far as I remember. So Power supplies are also important, but I resent the fact that after you spend a few thousand dollars on a high-end turntable, you still need to add more to play it accurately.

As for the Lenco's mentioned above, I have now two 75's and one 78 (NOS) in my home, NONE of them plays accurately. I already cleaned and oiled them, put on a refurbished idler wheel (new rubber) and nothing helped. I mentioned the tonearm - compliance issue above: the flutter is most pronounced when I use a Rega rb-250 arm, a bit less with SME 3009III, and least with Lenco's own arm and cartridge. Go figure. Now my audiobody tells me I should use a power line filter but, again, I believe a good turntable should play accurately out of the box, so to speak. I am therefore somewhat puzzled when I read the comments above that the Lenco is as accurate as the Technics sp-10. Not the ones I have here, and this is quite a representative sample, I believe. .

No to DD's: the most accurate turntable I have heard so far is the Goldmund Studio. To my ears it is CD accurate. I sold it to my audiobody since my wife didn't like its coloration (yes, from the motor). Indeed, compared to the NA it is VERY colored. But the fact is that whenever I want to listen to accurate piano music and no jitter (from my CD player, that is, which does play perfect pitch) I go to visit my friend. I wanted to buy it back from him but he is not willing to let it go. He sold his modern belt-drive deck and seems to be happy with it. So this says something about good DD. And so I’m still searching for a turntable that will be both neutral sounding like the NA, and pitch accurate like the Goldmund. I heard that (as some mentioned here) the heavy-platter ones are the way to go. But I still need to listen to one of them WITH MY OWN EARS. Sorry, I don't trust audiophiles anymore.
To my ears it is CD accurate.

Sorry, I don't trust audiophiles anymore.

Me neither. ;-)