Building high-end 'tables cheap at Home Despot II

A gent over at Lenco Lovers did some experiments using a cement filled plinth. The results had interfering transmission in the form of rumble that had to be eliminated with further secondary layering with a softer foam layering underneath.
His take on this was that sound (in the form of unwanted transmission) either passes through or is reflected off of dense material. It doesn’t simply vanish. The alternating of dense/soft layering as in the constrained plinth allows for an overall dissipation in transmission because of a scattering of unwanted interference because of the divergent pass-thru/ reflective properties of the materials used.

Before we all rush to give exalted properties to slate as plinth material (including myself), I would submit that it has more in common with this cement plinth than the constrained “sandwich”.

- Mario

Hi Mario

Not sure we can generalise with any of these 'stone' materials - there are many types of slate with differing qualities, the same can be said for: limestone (probably more so),sandstone, granites, marbles etc.

As concrete (I assume this is what is meant by cement) is made with OPC and an aggregate then is is also dependent on the qualities of said aggregate which could be any of the above materials or other e.g. lead shot. We might even get into the realms of Lime Concrete which would be different again.

Plus the LL experiment is only one sample, I would suggest that many more examples would need to be tested before one can state anything for certain.

I would also suggest that we need to dispose of the CLD 'blinkers' and accept that there may be other ways. I'm not even really sure what we are all doing with plinths actually is CLD in its true sense.

Willbewill,

I agree with you. There are lots of ways to accomplish what we are trying to do. Let's say you have found a perfectly neutral material, assuming you can define neutral. If neutral means that the material imparts no sound of its own, then you need mechanical components that will stand up to very close scrutiny because every audible flaw will surface. That takes you to a higher plane which is to replace flawed components with corrected ones. If you don't, then you need a plinth that imparts some color, so that subtle inconsistencies in the components will be masked, so the final sound is pleasing. It's a catch-22, at best.

I am reminded of what a well-known industry insider once told me. "...there are almost no true professionals in home audio, regardless of the stature, size of their businesses, or supposed qualifications..." So, we learn what we can, and go from there.

Regards,
mosin

.

Hi Malcolm,
You're right about generalizations. And my second sentence in the 2nd paragraph above should have contained wording that DF's experiment and conclusions were delivered as a postulation.
The whole field of plinthing is subject to asking if we'll ever really "be sure" about anything in this realm which has some definablly good empiricism and that will be trusted by all of the people all of the time.
But we might also be wary of accepting results of driven high-end marketers that, as a group, sometimes throw smokeballs our way.
There are no true experts in this new geologic/plinth field. As for Mosin's place in this discussion, it seems to me that objectivity is the first victim in the avenger's heart. This is not about truth, justice and the scientific way. He carries a perception of being slighted by JN ions ago. I got in the middle of that once - not this time.

- Mario

Received an e-mail this morning from Mosin. While it is not my practice to “out” people’s private communications to me, I trust that he won’t see it as an ethical breech to state he’s taken exception to my characterizing him as an “avenger” along with its implied objectivity sacrifice. I tend not to publicly characterize a person’s stumbles unless prepared to acknowledge tendencies to fall short along those same lines myself. When emotional buttons get pushed, objectivity can be separated from my person just as easily as cash from my wallet at a vintage audio swap meet. I certainly bear Winn no ill will. Despite the lengths we go to make our individual human condition appear orderly and rational, in the end, we’re all floundering about in this life. If you have any doubt on this, just cast a brief glance at our world affairs and the people we choose to run it.

But does that mean we should shrug off the task in attempting to maintain or gain orderliness and civility in the conduct of these mini affairs in human events? Wouldn’t that just be some sop toward “keeping up appearances”? Perhaps, but I’m an old dog in terms interpersonal dealings and not prepared to jettison the “old tricks” in trying to get along.

It is very obvious that the “Home Despot II” thread has become a shell of its former existence. As stated earlier, this is due, in large part, to the ascendency of Lenco Lovers with all that sites inherent advantages. But I also believe that a large part of this withering has come about because potential posters have become “gun shy” because of the historical pyro-technics here.

So as I see it, those who would like to “bring down the mighty” (and we all know how tempting an impulse that is for many) for whatever reason, to some extent have succeeded. There have been periodic forays onto this thread by posters whose sole want, seemingly, is to take it and Jean Nantais down. Sometimes this is done crudely and overtly, sometimes it is attempted with sophisticated cloaking.

There’s no real recourse of moderation of this thread, outside of the posters that decide to join in. My attempts at moderation have often left me often in the middle, open to being perceived as a “suck up” by one side or a Judas by the other. I have no problem dealing with that as a residual dessert here.

It does seem on the question of the future direction of this thread, if indeed it is to have one, what you, the current reader, believe should be its future course. We’re all moderators here. And we’re all in this together.

- Mario