Grand Prix Monaco review in new Stereophile- OUCH

Mtkhl567, When I opined that you did not need Mike Fremer's approval to validate your purchase, I was not intending to denigrate MF's opinion so much as to let you know that I think you are/were over-reacting to it. Mike has said here and elsewhere over and over again that he recommends we evaluate for ourselves the products he reviews, using his experiences only as a touchstone. He did not and probably would not say that you were "wrong" to buy the GPM, is all I meant. Anyway, I'd love to hear either table in a good home system, along with a Walker to compare to both. Not many folks will ever get such an opportunity, so Mike's work is of great value but should be taken with a "grain of salt". Dealer venues and audio shows don't tell us much.

Lewn, I agree with you on the enjoyment and purpose of this great hobby. I just think we should not all behave as if the politics, that I illuded to, are not going on.

You can do one of two things, close your eyes or speak up and say something about it. Wherever there are commercial interests involved there will be consideration in exchange for opinion from reviewers. In such a world those with the strongest sense of ethics will be the ones that deserve the most respect. Alvin Lloyd is one of those persons.

I know this may be a topic that spans much more than Mr Fremers GPM review, and unfortunately is widespread within the business, putting large questionmarks around much that is reviewed today.

Mtkhl567, I don't want to start a confrontation with you, I did the photography for Grand Prix, the same images used in Fremer's review.

I like Alvin Lloyd a lot, they don't get much better than him, we had a few days together getting the images of the Grand Prix table and I already use his stands under my amps.

Cut to the chase, do you really think Mike Fremer could not get ANY EQUIPMENT made at a deep discount? There are Audiogon members with connections that get great deals, imagine what one of the most influential writers in high end audio can get.

Point I'm making, he would not sabotage his career for a deal on equipment. It's just too damn easy for him to get whatever he wants anyway.

PLEASE do not confuse my argument with taking sides for or against the Grand Prix table. I have too little experience with it to argue but suspect Mike Fremer is speaking the truth, even if his taste and experience does not agree with you or others here at Audiogon.

Imagine if the review had been a rave for Evolution Acoustics, would you think he was being bribed to say they were good?

I should add here, I have never so much have been offered a soft drink by J. Tinn and I awarded him product of the year last November at PFO for the MM3.

Was that OK, or was it a wink and a nod from Tinn that made me do it?

11-15-07: Jaybo
A DP 1300mkII.. big brother of the 500m..its only being sold in japan at the moment, but can be exported through several retailers, and is coming officially to the states in 2008. an interesting return for denon to a competitive high end table, and inexpensive relative to just about everything.

I've found a couple of listings for this turntable, one at AudiocubesII and another on eBay from a vendor in Japan. I notice from the specs that the unit weighs about 10 lbs. more than the DP 500M, and the tonearm is 244mm vs. 230 for the DP 500M.

Does anyone know what else accounts for the DP-1300mkII's 3-times-the-price of the DP-500M?

The tonearm is also dual-gimbal S-shaped with detachable headshell, but is longer. Any other info on how it might be different? Damped? Optimized for today's low-medium compliance cartridges?

I'll bet this turntable with the Zu Audio DL-103 cartridge would just KILL!

Actually, here's the real answer:

http://denon.jp/company/release/dp1300_500.html

Run through Babelfish, it outlines a better DD motor, better tonearm with upgraded wiring, and bigger, heavier base.

Two interesting things: the release date for both the DP-1300 and the DP-500 was 2003; funny we're only hearing about the 1300 now. Also, the price in yen at the time of release was only about double, and now it's clearly triple.

David