Tri-Planar with no anti-skate?

Dan_ed
Am intrigued about your comment that all carts sound better on the Talea with AS.I have had the AS doggy stick in place on my Talea sans any weight(I had removed the AS from the Triplanar and believe it sounded better). A brand new Lyra Titan i arrived recently as a replacement for a wounded Orpheus L.Am trying to tweak the Talea/Titan i combo to come close to sounding even half as good as the Talea/Orpheus pairing but am pretty underwhelmed.The 1/2 gm to 1/3 rd gm you mention I presume relates to the smaller of the 2 cylindrical A/S weights that come with the Talea?
Apologies for hijacking the thread.
Pradeep

Pradeep! Good to hear from you!. Alas, that Orpheus L was truly hard to beat.

I think I put two small o-rings in the hardware kit for you. That is what I'm using for AS weight now after recommendations from Joel and a few other owners. This was about the time I shipped the arm to you so I'm not sure of myself. One, two, or three o-rings, and it seems related to the mass of the cart. When it's right the sound becomes fuller, much like when azimuth is correct. Too much and it collapses back again.

Dear Glai, You wrote:
"Consider a linear tracking arm which the headshell is not at an offset. For your statement to be true, there would mean no skating force and maximum tracking error. How could that be?"

My response is... What? My statement IS true for pivoted tonearms. It's not merely my opinion; it's a fact. The case you cite is a red herring if every I saw one. Pivoted tonearms in principle present us with this dilemma of a trade-off between tracking error and skating force. Linear tracking tonearms avoid the issue altogether, but by their nature they present new and different issues, as I am sure you know.

Lewm, I am talking about an increase in VTF by a tiny amount - considerably less than a hundredth of a gram. At the same time, when we speak of measuring THD as it relates to AS what is it exactly we are hearing? I think on the TP, the AS dogleg contributes as yet another resonant bit (like the dampening trough) - I find its removal beneficial to the overall sound by removing a tiny (but noticeable) coloration to the presentation. At the same time, there is a slight loss of depth and gravity to instruments in the R channel, but I find that adding a slight amount of weight (like .004 grams) seems to firm up and add weight back to the presentation. Perhaps I am suppressing an increase in THD via VTF due to my removal of the AS entirely; maybe I'm actually increasing THD and I simply like it - again, all the factors of setup interact intimately with one other. Am I merely trading one type of coloration/distortion for another? Probably. I guess it all depends on which type of dirt you like the best, or find the least offensive - because ultimately, it's all a little bit dirty, a little bit colored. In fact, if the goal was a "perfect" coloration-free audio system, I think most of us wouldn't be sitting here discussing such minutiae, because listening would be rather boring and sanitized - look where digital has brought us.

I have never set up a Triplanar arm, but, with every arm I have set up, when doing antiskating adjustment by ear (using torture test records or just long term listening), the setting I find that works is MUCH lower than that which the arm manufacturer recommended. This has been the case with both Graham 1.5t and Phantom arms, for the Vector 3 arm, and SME IV arm.

I believe that VPI concluded that the antiskating mechanism itself causes more sonic harm than skating forces (more loose parts to resonate and muck up the sound), but, was forced by the market to add such mechanism to their arms.

I wonder if anyone would dare to apply surgery to their expensive arm to remove such devices totally to see if that improves the sound.