2. analog
  3. 1245230390

tonearms with VTA-towers for true "VTAF"

Hi All,
I think the time has come to look at some more 'advanced' tone-arms that sport VTA towers. ('Old skool' is getting us not much further with this, or?))

During a lot of other, related postings it seems a good subject, I think.

Our experts, all might agree, that:

1) If you want to push the envelope for BEST possible replay, constant VTA 'adaptation' is an unavoidable matter. (nobody said madness :-)

2) I understand this means a TOP cart, inevitably with a 'most modern' type Fine-Line contact stylus, forget elliptical or can one even mention the word, spherical?

Add some TOP cantilever materials like:
- Beryllium (hard to get, as it is a very tricky material to work with i.e. very poisonous in powder form),
- Boron (which mostly has replaced the former),
- Titanium?? (was used by some of the better AT carts),
- Ruby, well some like it I hear,
- Sapphire?? (some one liked that better then Ruby, but VERY little seems about),
- Diamond (see e.g. the DV odd-ball 17D3), etc.

This should make for some VERY detailed and revealing reproduction (even in an MM cart), add to this the most revealing ingredients of a TOP LO-MC.

The end result is, that you can now here some marvellous detail (carved-outness of images, stage-depth -width, and on), B U T ONLY if your VTA is at its VERY closest to what the record was cut to! (Else you find your cart, record, arm, phono-pre, .... system sux :-)

More interesting yet, even the same vinyl brands have not always used the same cutting angles (over time). Anything from just under 20deg. to about 25deg. is what we find!

Next, these high res. styli also have each one their own preferred SRA / VTA angles, i.e. the stylus line-ridge related to the cantilever is a variable too.

Add this all up and you have a problem, particularly if you care for truly top play-back.

If you have a "VTA tower" it only seem to take 15sec. to change to the correct, previously found VTA, you do need to be organised though. If you want some know-how, Doug can tell, see also the discussion under:
"VTA setting for 'parabolic' and 'elliptical' styli"
http://forum.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/fr.pl?eanlg&1244713018

There we have mentioned 3 current contenders, I quote: "Graham, VPI, TriPlanar plus a few very costly linear trackers..."

WHAT ABOUT THE: Kuzma 4Point?!

If I wouldn't like e.g.:
- multiple added connections (Graham, 7 in total?)
- wobbly Unipivots (VPI)
- too many fiddly pieces to make up the arm (TriPlanar)
- air bearings, or worse yet 'electronic' arm-feed

If I'd have an issue with these, I've no working solution to the VTAF I'd be looking for.

What say you?

Greetings,
Axel

axelwahl
axelwahl OP
788 posts
 
Hi D. & Gregm,

well, well, well, ask for a sausage and get the hole pig :-)

I'm aware of the VTA vs. overhang influences, even before D. rubbed us all up on Egyptian geometry as applicable to tone-arms.

But, as we (maybe just me...) are now starting to accept that even 'minute' variation play more into it, then more generally accepted, even a more modern (low-tech?) VTA tower with a **robust** arm may be a proposition.
(Whilst we are awaiting the next big step -- Gregm's auto-calibration detector)

I had a look at the ET2 / ET2.5..., lo and behold, an AIR-BEARING linear-tracker, ouch.
Raul once mentioned, and I think he has a point, those would have some short comings in the bass and treble in lieu of a marvellous mid-range.
Some say: they can't 'close the acoustic loop' as those type of bearings can't 'sink' any arm-resonance... not to open yet another Pandora’s box, but it has some logic to it - at least for me.

So, beyond the "4Point" and it's 'minor' overhang related issue, is there anything else out there - that one actually can buy?

Greetings,
Axel
larryi
4,188 posts
 
I suppose that the easiest implementation to do repeatable VTA change would be the digital readout approach of the Kuzma. The other useful approach would involve changing VTA by remote control (Air Tangent). The VTA tower on the Triplanar and other on-the-fly implementations are still too much of a bother to me. Also, most VTA adjustment schemes do compromise arm rigidity/grounding of vibration to the turntable base. Those approaches designed to minimize the negative effect of a VTA calibration mechanism, such as the Basis/Vector approach, are not exactly convenient for making constant changes.

Still, changing VTA constantly would be a BIG hassle that would, for me, largely negate the pleasure of listening to records. For me, the biggest concern is with varying thickness of LPs affecting VTA. For that, the only somewhat easy to implement way to mitigate the problem is a long tonearm.

Vinyl listening inherently involves listening past a whole lot of performance compromises. Remarkably, it is still one of the most enjoyable of media. I just choose to ignore the comromise of non-optimum VTA for each record.
dertonarm
1,042 posts
 
Dear Axel, yes, a FR-64s w/B-60 VTA-on-the-fly base.
Still about the most comfortable VTA ever made.
Not really a surprise this proposal coming from me sooner or later........

The new VTA-base by TW is another option and more universal.
The Technics EPA-500 system tonearm is another.
Then there is the old working horse MA-505.

The ET2(2.5) performance in the lower register do very much depend on air flow and pressure. With the usually used Hi-blow and Wisa pumps its indeed quite poor. But there are other more sophisticated options regarding air supply and these do greatly enhance the bass performance - but still not to top-notch-level, while comparable with most that is there today for much higher retail.
The ET2.5 is vastly underated and needs only a bit of brain and investment in the periphery to become a top contender.

Cheers,
D.
kristian85's avatar
kristian85
41 posts
 
Well, wow, that's some serious stream-of-consciousness rambling there, but another contender in a state-of-the-art airbearing linear tracker is available for far less than usual in a Trans-Fi Terminator 3. See link: http://www.trans-fi.com/terminatortonearm.htm .

I just received mine; it's beautifully made and a shocking bargain.
dertonarm
1,042 posts
 
Dear Kristian85, interesting attempt indeed.
Good value for the money too. The VTA-adjustment however does have the same problem as the Air Tangent, Denessen, Goldmund T-3F, Kuzma Airline and all pivot tonearms - the adjustment of VTA does change the overhang and thus the whole geometry does loose "track".
Even on a linear tracker...
Cheers,
D.
More to discover