New 'Vinyl Flat' flattener?

Although I've noticed from my own, non-scientific tests that the Vinyl Flat works, it works like a charm. I appreciate all of you who go to the extremes in testing, but IMO, no need. I've had experiences in which, say, Janis Ian "Between the Lines" original pressing was wavy when I bought it used. I put it in the pouch for 4 hours, it came out basically the same, I put it in for 4.5 hours, still pretty much the same. This "original" lp must be of a different vinyl formulation. Just a note, the lp sounded great before and great after. I've had more positive results with the same weight vinyl in other trials. The main point here is, with the pouch, I think it's impossible to destroy the grooves. I've flattend at least 100 lps, on two, I've left them in 3 hours longer than usual, NO DAMAGE to the grooves. This is an extremely well thought out product and the most enjoyable product I've ever purchased in the pursuit of vinyl playback. My personal finding is for a regular weight lp, 4.5 hours, a 180gr. 4.45 hours. This can vary upward when the warp is more severe than usual.
Sonfjim: After reservations, I emailed John Martindale about the 45 issue, he said no problem. I subsequently tried one, first at 4 hours, then at 4.5 hours. NO DAMAGE.

Rarely has the Vinyl Flat not at least improved a warp for me. In many cases, it eliminates them. I have no experience with 45s but I would assume a properly sized groovy ring would optimize results.

Based upon the great input from the Steve Hoffman web site, I recently purchased a very nice Beatles Blue Box. It is a 1982 version of the Box. Maybe not the Holly Grail but really nice all analog records. The one problem I had with the box is that several records were warped. Two of the records, With the Beatles and Revolver, would not track on my VPI Scoutmaster with Soundsmith VPI/Zephyr cartridge. I started looking around on e-bay for replacements of similar vintage. The problem is that other than the warps, the records were in fantastic condition. Maybe played once or twice at the most.

A year ago or so, I read about the Viny Flat in Stereophile in a Stephen Mejias article. He is a skilled writer, and in-spite of a catastrophic failure, I figured I would give it a try. Since Stephen’s failure involved cooking the record in the oven, I skipped the oven and bought the Vinyl Flat Groovy Pouch.

I went right for it and tried fixing With the Beatles. My first attempt followed the instructions and cooked the record in the Groovy Pouch for 4 hours. I allowed the record to cool in the Vinyl Flat, without heat, for another 4 hours of so. Yes, the record was approximately 50% better but it still caused my cartridge to miss-track. I then tried 6 hours in the Groovy Pouch. Now the record tracked but still had a hump that caused an audible noise. I next let the record cook for 12 hours and cool in the Vinyl Flat for another 12 hours. What came out of this process was a nearly perfectly flat record without any trace of damage to the record. It played and looked perfect!! Next was Revolver which I just let cook right off the bat for 12 hours and allowed it to cool in the Vinyl Flat for nearly a week. On the first attempt, Revolver was fixed. I now have a nearly perfect Beatles Blue Box.

I cannot say enough about this product. I also cannot imagine a scenario where the system, using the Groovy Pouch, would damage a record. It cooks it low and slow. My advice to anyone who tries the Vinyl Flat is to be patient. Let it cook a long time and then let it cool a long time in the Vinyl Flat. Also, spend the extra $60.00 and buy the Groovy Pouch. I would not use the oven. Also note that the Beatles Blue Box records were pressed on pretty thin vinyl. I don’t have any experience using this product with heavier vinyl. My guess is that the cook times would be very long. My start time for any record, heavy or thin vinyl, would be 8 hours and move to longer times depending upon the result.

The Vinyl Flat and companion Groovy Pouch is a fantastic product at a nice price. It is very well constructed and should last a life time. If there is one concern, the Groovy Pouch seems a bit fragile but I handle it with some caution and expect it to last a life time. If you have some valuable, but warped records, give this product a shot. I think you will be happily surprised at the results.

Dale

I agree on the pouch time. Seems pretty unlikely that a record could "over cook" in this thing. I have found some records that aren't fixed by it but the ones that are more than make up for that.

In answer to the heavier vinyl question, my experience has been that the Vinyl Flat is more effective on heavier vinyl for whatever reason. The 180 gm and 200 gm discs have come out the flattest for me.