2. analog
  3. 1335032038

Turning lead into gold ?

Ok I'll admit a lot of stuff we read about makes this claim,but how often are we less than satisfied by the results?

I'd make a wild guess and say that most of the time what we hope will make a huge improvement to our sound,never does ,or at least not to the extent we wished for.

Perhaps that's because most of us are not privileged to do a review of the gear in question with components that can reveal such improvements.

To put it simpler,move up to a better turntable, such as the SME10, Sme V arm,and pop in a brand new pricey cartridge and audio nirvana should be a given.

And I would agree, I've just done that.
Moved up to the SME10,SME V combo.
Not the brand new pricey cartridge however.

Where things have taken a turn is that while waitng for my new upgraded cartridge to arrive,I've had to sink a few levels low and resort to an old, well worn Grado Platinum.

This I thought would be like putting re-treads on a Porsche, and about as foolish as one can get.

Who has ever read any review of an arm or turntable where the reviewer ever used anything but the very best most pricey cartridge available?
Mikey are ya lisning?

But hey when you can eat steak everyday of the week, why settle for a hot dog if you don't have to?

So by all accounts the component in review has a best case scenario for a great review.
Most times this is the case, but some stellar casts of all star performers have been turkeys at the box office ,we've all been privy to these.

But I digress.

What I found out when I had to use the old Grado, was that, I didn't think the sound was bad at all.
It was much better than I had expected, and the new cartridge for 6 times the price should be a game changer, or it better be.

Surprisingly, I never heard in past tables and arms how good that Grado was.
It was always an entry level item, a step along the way,to a much better sounding one.
Or so I always thought.

I now have a new found respect for this old cartridge, and also for how great the Sme combo is.

So the whole point of this is to not just pass some time on a rainy day, like I'm doing with the SME/Grado combo.

It's to point out that the measure of greatness isn't just when all the moons align in perfect sync.

It's when you can add something less than stellar to an all star cast and not feel any less impressed by the performance.

Will the new MC cartridge outperform the Grado?
My guess is yes,and I'll be impressed,but that's just what the reviewers would tell you also, so no news there.

What impresses me most about the SME combo is not that it will make a two grand cartridge sound good, but that it has made a well worn $300.00 one sound so good.

Lead into gold?
lacee
lacee OP
811 posts
 
This experience has me wondering how good the Grado Statement Ref would sound.

I have a friend with the SME 30,V arm and listened to the Stradivari and then the Goldfinger cartridges, however not at the same listening session.

The main reason I went for the Talisman V2 gold, was because of the way the top Clearaudios worked in his system.Also, the fact that it was in my price range.

I haven't used a coil since back in the late 1970's,80's -Fidelity Research MK13f, and Dynavector Karat Ruby.
Back then the table was an Oracle Delphi mk3 and an ET2 linear arm.

A bad experience with the Dyna(snagged the ruby on my sweater)led to years of digital only and then when back into vinyl, the Grado Platinum seemed like not too much to loose if I had another accident.

I used the Grado in my Rega P9 but it never performed like it did in the SME.

I should add that a friend now owns my P9 and uses an old MC and I never heard that table sound so good.

Like everything else, it's about combinations that either work together or they don't.

I suppose somewhere there must be a list of tables, arms and cartridges that folks have found to work well with one another, and a list of combinations that don't.

If there isn't, somebody should start one.
route30
16 posts
 
How many hours did it take for break in & bass to come alive?
stringreen's avatar
stringreen
6,524 posts
 
Hi Cousin.....Why would I be displeased with you.? In my experience, all components create a synergy with each other toward or away from Nirvana. Personally, I was glad to be rid of my SME V since it didn't work with the cartridge I had in it at the time....although I've heard that arm sound fine with other cartridges with which it just gets along well. I knew Joe Grado well...he sang at the Met in New York, and know well, that he knew what real music supposed to sound like. I suspect that the Grado here works well with the SME...all to the good. My experience, or should I say my appreciation is for the nuances that a more refined cartridge can contribute to the party. I remember the SME being a bit bloated in the bass, and not as refined and extended in the highs....I remember the Grado I had (I think it was the Sonata low output) was bloated in the bass, and not as refined and extended in the highs. Isn't it interesting that the op liked the Grado/SME.....not to say that the op's idea of real music in real space is flawed... I just think that synergy is everything. High end audio is loaded with unexpected pleasures and trolls.
lacee OP
811 posts
 
I've grown more accustomed to the sound of the Clearaudio cartridge.
Just as I had to the Grado in a different turntable set up.

I pretty much changed my whole system , the only constant was the Grado.It never sounded as good on the P9 as it did on the SME 10/V set up.

When I sold the P9 to a friend,I never heard that table sound as good as I guess it is capable of sounding .He was using an upscale MC on it and it was very good.

The Talisman has perhaps broken it, the tonearm wires (Nordost)have not.

Maybe I like bloated bass,and the Talisman will have nothing of that.

Real music in real space.

That's a concept that I find is past it's due date.

Unless I sit in exactly the same spot as Stringreen,my experience of live music in a real space won't be the same as his.
Where is the best seat in the house, the one that has the magic?
I also doubt our ears will be exactly the same, and give or take a few dozen other differences, has made me quite aware that no two real music in real space experiences will ever be the same.

We are dealing with recordings and the way the gear reproduces those recordings, which is an illusion afterall.
Listening to recordings thru our gear is all about our own preconcieved ideas about the way things should sound.
These systems are all flawed and it's a wonder that we even like them at all, seeing as they are so far away from real music in a real space.

Even if the microphone was in the exact same spot as your seat,I know for a fact that after all the electronics, it will not be anywhere near real music in real space that you remembered from that seat.

It's a great myth that we like to believe in that keeps our interest in this hobby, but I gave up on trying to achieve that absolute sound years ago.

I have never once heard reproduced sound come anywhere close to what I experience when I play live music.
And that's from one of the best seats in the house.
nandric's avatar
nandric
4,086 posts
 
Not from lead but certainly from copper. See, for exaple,
the Nord Ost prices.
More to discover