cable burn-in / system burn-in

Rodman,

Thanks for your thoughts about capacitance. When you say that the dielectric material "charges" (so to speak) over time, it seems to me as though the cable should sound worse over time. And the more charged, the worse it should sound.

The reason I say this is because air dielectric sounds best. And air is less chargeable than the worst sounding of the dielectrics, namely PVC. Electrostatic build-up is a very bad thing for audio, which is alternating current. Hence the many products on the market to avoid this.

So I don't agree with the "charging up" theory for dielectrics as the reason for cable burn-in resulting in a more natural sound.

I presently believe that the burn-in process could be due to something we can learn from what we know about magnetic domains.

When magnetic domains are large, or else there are several of them charged magnetically in a similar direction, the result is magnetism on a larger scale. Magnetism is a flux, a movement and direction of force.

Indeed, scale is all there is to magnetism. The stronger the magnet, the more uniform the domain orientation.

It could be that an amount of a different type of magnetic domains are present in wire such as copper or silver, which do not display ferromagnetism, as iron does. Perhaps "magnetic domains" is not the proper term, since there is no memory to speak of. Hence, no lasting magnetism. The domains might be present but not lasting, as they are in magnetized iron.

I postulate that during instantaneous applications, such as that of an electromagnetic alternating current running in real-time, perhaps these types of "magnetic domains" I am imagining are indeed active and influence instantaneously the electromagnetic signal in some small way.

So, getting rid of these gets rid of the memory of the cable's metal. Even if it is copper or silver.

A speculative analogy, crossing the fields of magnetism and psychology:

Magnetic memory in iron would be like the recollection of something fixed in your own mind. You can draw this thought up at any time (= detect the magnetism at any time). It "stays put".

Memory in copper or silver would be like associative thought in your mind, brought forth by the similarity of one thought to another. Thoughts in this state of flux are intertwined and depend on the preceding thought. It must "move" to be awakened.

So, if my theory is correct, if we can get rid of the "associative" type of memory in copper or silver, we've achieved the ultimate burn-in we can possibly achieve. The signals should pass without awaking associatively operating domains in the non-ferrous metal of the wire.

The reason I think this is true is that even cables with 99,999999 (add as many nines as you please...) pure silver with air dielectric still burns in.

Louis Motek

Johnhelenjake,

One thing you need to do is maintain perspective here. The changes in cables being discussed are extremely small - much much less than 0.1%. You need to consider that these effects are likely so small as to be inaudible compared to other differences (your head position, the volume level, speaker driver compliance, and your hearing from one session to the next)

Lessloss- You apparently didn't read anything I posted. A dielectric will only charge to a degree, then it stops. That can be predicted, and therefore a cable or capacitor can be "voiced". I also stated that it's only part of the issue of burn in. You're not disagreeing with me, but with science. Perhaps you can grasp this much shorter treatise on the subject: (http://www.empiricalaudio.com/computer-audio/technical-papers/dielectric-absorption-dissipation-factor-and-q)

I just started my system again after being down for a few months. It has taken about 40hrs of play time before it has started to sound good again. I have a cd that I always play to hear the effect, which I am very familiar with. So it is kind of scientific, and not just arbitrary. So there you have it...

If you listened to music on other systems (radio, car, iPod) then this might be partly acclimatization.

If the room has changed or the position of equipment/istening position has changed then you may be acclimatizing to the new presentation (emphasis is different when equipment position/room changes and this makes your CD sound different even if your gear has not changed - this change can be HUGE and of the order of several percent at specific frequencies and sometimes even much more - changing slightly the timbre of some sounds and instruments and until you get used to this new emphasis and re-adjust your sonic memory then you will notice this)

When trying to detect small effects of less than 0.1 % or much much lower it is actually not "kind of scientific" to trust your judgement and sonic memory of a particular CD. Hearing is good but nothing like as resolving as a measurement made through precision instruments. For example it is extremely difficult to hear the difference between 0.1 % distortion and 1% distortion when listening to music -even though the difference is TEN TIMES.

Another factor that can make a real difference that will be audible is your capacitors in your equipment. If you have had your equipment in storage for many many months then some of the capacitors (depending on the design) may need reforming or may have broken down when you first powered up. This can make a difference that would in certain cases be large enough to be audible. Another factor could be stiffening of the conpliance of your speaker drivers after months of no use.

I am simply saying that you should look at all possibilties before assuming it is related to cable burn in. (Wires are the least likely item in the entire human hearing/room/system equation to cause an audible difference that you attribute to burn in)