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Hi-Fi Fuses - SNAKE OIL? - or something in it?

There's a lot of chatter about the benefits of those high prices gold plated fuses with silver conductor etc. etc. all over the web and the consensus ranges from FANTASTIC!!! to much more subtle observations.

It makes sense to me, epseically in light of spending lots of $$$ on good power cables, that having a skinny piece of aluminum conductor in a glass tube (i.e. a cheap fuse), in the power loop would be detrimental to the performance of the components.

I decided to revamp my DIY power supply I'd built for the Cambridge Audio 640p phono stage and DACmagic in order to test this out - and since it's a DIY project there is no UL Certification to void.

First, I bypassed the fuse link completely to confirm there would be an improvement and give me the best benchmark to compare against - YEP - BIG DIFFERENCE - much more this, that and the other :-)

So then I started looking for hi-fi fuses - WOW!!! - talk about pricey.

Two fuses for the power supply was going to cost $120+ AND I thought I'd probably have to buy a better quality fuse block to make the most of those fuses.

Then a moment of enlightenment - most power supplies and conditioners are protected by pushbutton breakers and not fuses.

I found breakers of the required current rating and installed them into the power supply. I imediately noticed that there was no deteriation in fidelity when compared to the same unit with the fuse link bypassed - GREAT!.

On reflection, the fuses I had in place were rated at 3 amps - so they use a pretty thin fuse wire in them. If I had used a fuse of a higher rating, i.e. it uses a thicker conductor, then I believe that there would be less of a difference between the fused and bypassed implementations

SO - do the expensive fuses work?

Well the empirical evidence out there would suggest they do
- I do know the cheap fuses are not good!

I know bypassing them does improve the sound - a lot in my case
- BUT THAT'S NOT SAFE FOR ONGOING USE

I know breakers work as good as bypassing the fuse
- BUT MESSING WITH A POWER SUPPLY VOIDS UL CERTIFICATION - NOT GOOD!
- FYI a couple of licensed technicians I know WILL NOT change the design of a power supply at all.

I believe the amount of benefit is related to the fuse rating
- but don't go replacing 3 amp fuses with a 20 amp fuse - that's not safe either.

Whilst looking for fuses I discovered AMR Gold fuses priced at $20/fuse.

Now that's definately more affordable than most others at 3-4 times their price.

One supplier I know of in the US is Avatar Aacoustics

If you have had experience with quality fuses please share - especially if they are "modestly priced" i.e. $20-$30 per fuse. And please provide a source :-)

Also, can anypne confirm that Slow blow fuses are better than regular?

And Remember - IF YOU AIN'T LICENCED - GET A TECHNICIAN!

Many Thanks
williewonka
jeff_jones
418 posts
 
Figured I'd try one more time.
Normally when '60 minutes' or whatever smells a scam they go looking behind the curtain for things like manufacturing plants , u.l. lab test reports, etc.
Is there anybody out there that has ever seen a boutique fuse manufacturing facility ?
williewonka OP
3,075 posts
 
Lacee....

For all the avid snake oilers of the new inquisition, I have seldom seen any mention of what products to stay away from.
What companies to avoid.

And most importantly what products "they have tried"that proved to be snake oil.

First, there is a little thing called libel
- it's easy for a company to extol the virtues of their product, even without "proof" (many do), but much harder for someone to refute their claims. Word of mouth is one thing, putting it in writing on a forum - whole different kettle of fish!

Second - if people were to report their failures this forum would be immense
- and very tough to seperate wheat from chaff :-)

Third, people just may not wnat anyone to know about their failures.
- in fear of the rebukes they "might" receive in return.

As you well know - the effectiveness of a component/cable/tweak/etc is relative to the system/components it was "auditioned with".

My atrategy in considering reported products is to do some "due diligence" and revue the system the poster is using (if available) in order to understand why the claim might be valid.

After all a $30,000 speaker cable might not prove "as effective" if I have a $20 interconnect from the phono stage to the amp.

Conversly - nay-sayers should understand that a $30,000 speaker cable on a $200k system might just be the cat's meow! Just pop into your local Audiophile Store for a test drive :-)

From that perspective, I prefer to see reports only on the positive, then I can extrapolate from only those experiences together with available data.

So, we are left with an imperfect, but workable method of communicating our findings.

Without forums like this the thousands of products and a vast wealth of knowledge pertaining to this hobby would be lost to the majority of us

Your words are not lost on the readers - I'm sure they resonate with many, and there's always someone willing to challenge :-)

You keep on posting - we'll keep on reading:-)
williewonka OP
3,075 posts
 
One last thing I forgot in the above post

If a reader is considering a product and cannot find it in a search on Agon - post a question about it - you almost always get some feedback - good or bad :-)
lacee
811 posts
 
Most definitely ,I agree,not everything will work exactly the same.

Too many variables,and a lot of folks just don't dot all i's and cross all the t's when they evaluate things.

Putting an upgraded fuse into a system that is mostly just a source of background music won't reveal much of anything about how much better it is over the stock one.

One reason why I feel a lot of folks fail to distinguish the better fuses.
If the interconnects don't cost $20.00 how will the fuse help?

It's all about the level of resolve of the system that the snake oil tweaks are used with.

And the ability of the user in identifying chnges in his system.

This takes critical listening, not casual listening.
Which I believe is what the music lovers just aren't interested in.

So you need to be of a different mindset.

You also need to know the "sound" of your system, and have a few recordings that you know inside and out.

You need to be able to distinguish different sounds,before and after a tweak.

Does the new tube, fuse, interconnect, make the cymbal sound fuller, or thinner?
Does it sound more metallic or do the cymbal"s splash sound just like the splash of rain on a tin roof and nothing at all like metal being struck with wood?

Do the handclapss in a live recording sound like real hands clapping or again does it sound like rain in the background?

You need to be able to listen for these things.

Only then will things stop sounding all the same or make no difference.

I feel that even the worst snake oil products would have some effect on the sound.
If not better, then at least worse.

But to impart no sound at all is not what I can accept.

Newton's Law , every action has a reaction still applies to audio.

It's more about the ability to distinguish changes as much as it is about the ability of the tweak to make a change.
mapman's avatar
mapman
22,198 posts
 
Lacee,

Do you think it is possible that in some cases with good systems and good ears that user hears no difference replacing an existing "standard issue" fuse with a Hi FI fuse?

My opinion is that there may be a discernible difference for the better in some cases but not all. Afer all, what you start with matters as much as what you try as a change when it comes to hearing a difference.
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