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Who pays for busted stuff?

I bought a Nak tape deck from a gent here; I made an offer, he counteroffered with a slighly higher price, including shipping. We agreed, and it was left up to him to select the shipper. You guessed it, UPS ground. So the deck finally gets to me, the box looks like it hasn't sustained any real damage. I unpack it and it looks terrific. I plug it in, and the "load" and "autoreverse" features will not work at all. I get a brief grinding sound and then nothing. At first I though I really ought to have made sure the transport screw was removed. It wasn't there, so a non-issue. I wrote the seller "the boyz in brown showed up tonight at 8:00 with the deck, overtime I suppose. The Nak is in as new cosmetic
condition, really nice. Now for the "but". The "load" and "reverse" features do not work, makes an odd brief grinding
sound and will not eject nor reverse the cassette. Am I doing something wrong?" The seller wrote me back (promptly) "Read the manual carefully. Everything always worked fine for me. Keep trying, maybe something went to sleep". Now to the question...the seller packed the item in it's original box (and did not secure the transit screw), selected the carrier, and now the deck needs repair. I can't see how I could make a claim with UPS since the deck looks prisitine and the box has normal wear. The gent insists that when he shipped it to me it was working perfectly. Assuming the deck does not "wake up" I'll need to get this serviced locally (if any of you have an idea what may be wrong I'd appreciate hearing from you), who pays for the repair?
jeffloistarca
daddyo
25 posts
 
First of all, Jeff, glad to hear that your problem has been diagnosed and should be a relatively simple (inexpensive) repair.

On your general question, there seems to be a consensus that if the unit didn't arrive in the condition advertised, then the seller should work with the buyer to make it right. I concur. The only exception I can see to this is what happened to Erwbear in the above post.

If the Buyer INSISTS on a shipping method other than what the Seller is comfortable with, then I feel that the buyer assmes any shipping damage related expenses. Of course, the seller should clarify this with the buyer BEFORE shipping the item. Somthing like: "Okay, at your insistence I'll send this out USPS, but if it is damaged in transit, you will have to take it up with the Post Office. Do you still want me to send it out via USPS?"

If the seller chooses the shipping vendor, then shipping damage claims would fall upon him since he made the selection.

As always, clear communication is paramount.
ejlif's avatar
ejlif
1,376 posts
 
I shipped a mint condition Meridian player and when it arrived it didn't work and had some cosmetic damage. I had argued with the buyer a bit about shipping UPS ground because I think they are rough handlers. He didn't want to pay the extra, so I agreed. I insured the package, and it was obvious that UPS had caused the damage. I decided to refund the buyers money and deal with the claim myself. In hindsight I think I should have told the buyer that because had insisted on the cheapest way to ship it should be his problem. I did nothing wrong, the unit was double boxed in original styrofoam packing, plus I added my own bubble wrap around the player. Of course those low down dirty rats at UPS denied the claim on grounds of improper packing, so I filed a lawsuit against them, the only problem is they somehow managed to not get served, so the other day I went to court all prepaired and I was told that the date would have to be rescheduled. UPS is the worst 2 faced company I have ever dealt with, and I am not going to give this thing up even if I have to hire a lawyer. If you ship something expensive via UPS ground and they damage it, no matter what the packing or insurance, you better plan on having to sue them to get your money.
sdcampbell
2,136 posts
 
For those who choose to ship via USPS -- my memory tells me that the item becomes the property of the addressee once USPS takes possession. If so, the seller is not obligated to "make things right". The other aspect of shipping USPS is that sending an item that is not as described to the buyer may constitute mail fraud. Can anyone confirm this?
cornfedboy
1,645 posts
 
sd: since you asked, the us federal crime of "mail fraud" constitutes the use of the us mails in a "scheme or artifice to defraud". 18 USC Sec. 1341. "...the term 'scheme or artifice to defraud' includes a scheme or artifice to deprive another of the intangible right of honest services." 18 USC Sec.1346. so yes, one may commit mail fraud by intentionally describing an article sent via the usps as in "flawless condition" when it is not or by failing to describe a material defect in such product. the chances of one being prosecuted for a single instance of "puffing" the condition of a piece sold on the internet, however, is less than zero. -kelly
albertporter's avatar
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albertporter
4,949 posts
 
Thanks Kelly, as always you are the clear answer for tough legal questions.
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