DIY speaker: braid vs twist vs straight

(Thanks TWL)

CDC: TWL pretty much covers it. Also I like and will try his "big" tubing idea on the magnet wire that I have when I set up the second system.

Yes, the thin coating on magnet wire can become compromised (I always kept +/- separated with cotton ties/ribbon placed @ various places along the path), but again will try "big" tubing next time as it's more a sure thing (plus to see if it sounds better due to added damping).

TWL: Are you using clear inexpensive Lab tubing (the kind also used on ice makers in refrigerators), or is it Teflon tubing? Just curious as I have a bunch of the Lab stuff (used it for bare wire IC's once). Fry's has Teflon tubing now (and it is also not too expensive).

CDC: If you also end up trying the 18 gauge magnet wire then by all means experiment with Audioengr's recipe. When we (TWL & myself) recommend not twisting/braiding, this is in regard to the smaller gauge wire (not larger gauge solid core wire, such as 18 gauge).

Again, don't worry about the smaller gauges as long as the runs do not exceed 12' (8'-12' is the best range, IMO, for the smaller gauge wire based on trial and error).

As far as your BI-wirable speakers go, yes try 22/bottom and 26/top. Other options are running a single gauge through the bottom binding posts and then on up to the top posts all in one piece (you will have to strip the sections that make contact with the bottom posts, a well as the ends). If your speakers are out of warranty you could remove the internal leads from the top posts and attach them to the bottom posts (the speakers are no longer BI-wirable, but you have eliminated a set of binding posts in the signal path).

You could also try the "twisted" 18 gauge (two ply should be fine) on the bottom and then run a "short" single wire "jumper" (22-26 gauge) from the bottom posts to the top ones. I would not combine a single 12' run of the smaller wire on the top with a run of the twisted 18 gauge on the bottom as these cables will have very different voices and will sound odd. A short jumper (3"-6") however does not have this effect (guess such a short run does not have much character @ all:-) as I have tried this with braided Kimber Kable (on the bottom) and short 26 gauge jumpers running to the top (sounded good on a pair of Castle Isis speakers).

Don't mean to confuse you, but I am remembering all of the "cheap" things that I tried when I had the Castle's (current speakers are not BI-wirable). The best thing that I did (right off the bat) was to get rid of the stock plate jumpers and use a short run of speaker cable instead (big improvement in the mids and HF's).

I have to install some other gear in the living system next week (a preamp and a tuner) in order to test it and maybe I will get around to messing around with TWL's "big" tube idea. I will let you know if I do (I have the magnet wire and tubing on hand). The second system probably won't go up anytime in the near future (the room needs to be cleared out first).

Dekay, my big tubing is from Lowe's. I think it is polyethelene. I would have liked to have gotten Teflon, but I wanted to get the wires done, and didn't want to wait for mail order. Also, I figured that if the wire was not having alot of contact with the tubing that it wouldn't matter as much. I used 22ga, because my reading of the skin-effect literature said that 22ga is still under the skin-effect depth of copper. Single conductor runs reduce smear. To separate the runs, I used plastic Tee nipples about every 18" and connected them with a 2" piece of tube. This creates a kind of "ladder" appearance to the speaker cables, with the 2 runs staying about 2 1/2" apart. I guesstimated that 2 1/2" spacing would eliminate/reduce field interaction between the feed and return. If this is increasing the inductance, I sure can't hear it in any loss of high freq's. They look pretty exotic.I really don't know how much all this affected the sound, as I didn't A/B them without the tubing, and then with it. I just did it because I thought it would work out right. I am happy with the result. I will say this much: If these wires are holding any of my signal back, then I will sh!t bricks when I hear it with better cables. It is sounding REAL good right now.

This has been a very helpful thread.
Audioquest says "Simple evaluation of multiple sizes reveals that audible skin-effect induced anomalies begin with a strand (or conductor) larger than .8mm. A much smaller strand yields no benefits but encourages the problems discussed below....".
http://www.audioquest.com/theory/theory2.html

.8mm = .0315" dia = 20 gauge wire = maximum size wire to use

I don't know about the benefits of lacquer vs. enamel but since the magnet wire I found is enamel so I'll go with that. Enamel should be more durable and less prone to cracking than lacquer.

Dekay, large diameter teflon tubing is expensive. Here are prices for 3/8" i.d. x 1/32" wall teflon tubing from http://www.mscdirect.com. You may need to buy 100 feet at a time.
Part number.....type of teflon.....price per foot
48700090........PTFE teflon..........1.66
48702096.........FEP.................1.83
48701098.........PFA.................3.40
heavy wall - 1/16 thick
48702591..........FEP................3.99
48701593..........PFA................5.96

Dekay, do you have a link for Michael Percy magnet wire?

If you want heat shrink teflon tubing:
http://www.mcmaster.com has teflon moisture proof tubing for $10.00 for 4 foot length. .015" wall thickness. P/N 7960K31.
"The PTFE outer layer shrinks for a tight fit and the FEP inner layer melts to provide a moisture-proof seal."

You could build up a couple of layers and get a similar construction as the 47 Labs OTA stuff.

Hi CDC: A couple of layers is $5/ft (I would just purchase another 47 Labs kit, which is less expensive, if I could budget this:-).

Michael Percy is @ percyaudio.com and he has a catalogue download (I use PayPal when ordering).

Glad to hear that the new cables sound good (give them 50 hours, or so, of playing time and don't get upset if they have their ups and downs during this period of time). Not having HF/LF rolloff, means that you are within the realms/synergy of your system, good go.

I don't really know the difference between lacquer/enamel though such is detailed in a thread @ A'gon by a member named Tesla. If the RS wire uses enamel then this is OK (I like the sound of them).

The tubing sounds like "lab" tubing. I used this for bare wire IC's and it sounded very nice. Guess that it depends on how much wire contact is taking place?

Yes, the tubing is funky looking (kind of hard to sell such a commercial cable:-), but who cares if it sounds good and meets one's budget?

I have a 35 ft roll of thick 18 gauge Teflon tubing from Fry's, a local store, that was $7.95 (can't remember what I bought it for). I will check to see if they have a larger size then next time I am in the area.