Audience Au24 vs. Ridge Street Audio?

Whoa , hold on boys. If I knew nothing about Ridge Street Audio's Poeima's and read the above two posts , I would conclude that the cables only sound good with special speakers and a $100,000 system. The basics on my system are a Classe CDP-10, a Classe SSP-60, a Classe 301 and Legacy Signature III speakers. In my system the Poeima's sound great. I discovered this when I owned Audience AU 24 cables but this applies to any cables as far as Im concerned. On your digital front end , you should use some type of PC filtering whether it be a Power cord , Power conditioner or both. {Every cable, interconnect and speaker} should never touch a power cord . This reduces dramatically any "noise" or "glare" coming down the stream. I would hardly call my system Class A, and the Poeima's in my system are not "too much" , they are "perfecto" .

Psychicanimal- No, I am not one of those that "have to have the best." I chose components for their performance, not their price tag. The same holds true with cabling, as well as the RSA in MY system. I actually talked to Robert about this, as he also felt there was either a impedance or capacitance (don't recall which) issue between the preamp and the amp perhaps. He also offered to make another cable to correct the situation and send it out right away. Robert and his cables are first rate. I truly wish there were more companies like his! However, with that being said I made the post due to letting others know there is always something to be said for system matching. Most of the time system synergy comes into play when you least expect it.

I was not just going off on a tangent about RSA. I spoke with many on the cable interaction... from the manufacturer of equipment, to the Cable Company, who keeps track of systems and what works well with some speaker lines. For expample - from what I was told there are several dozen speakers out there that do not mate well with silver. Silver. Not RSA, but any silver cable. I wasn't trying to knock RSA, but to inform others that some speakers will react better to some cables than other. I don't chose cables to be a "tuning device" and that is what attracted me to Ridge Street Audio. I chose components on performance. In this particular case there was a mismatch somewhere. I was told that in particular Meadowlark speakers don't mate well with silver. Is that a fact? I don't know. Do I know how it sounded? Yes - the Ridge Street Audio Poiema's in my system sounded as if one speaker were wired out of phase. It was not "noise" or "digital glare" as you mentioned in your post. It was a compressed soundstage, and a prominant "reverb" in harmonics when there was a complex passage in the music.

As for copper cables quieter, again I don't know. I am not proposing them. If you take the time to look at my system I can assure you I don't have system "noise." Since the insertion of the Balanced Power Technologies BPT-3.5 Signature the background is dead quiet. Again, if you look at my system, I use an Electrocompaniet EMC-1UP for digital front end, many, many users here on A'gon will attest to this being one of the most analog sounding cd players out there! "digital glare?" - don't think so from there. Perhaps the Quicksilver tube gear or the Meadowlarks are inherently producing the noise or glare? Don't think so, as you can hear a pin drop now. Why? I can't say. I didn't purchase the "best" cabling from Synergistic Research but again basing on how I personally judge gear, by its performance, there is no comparison - and I will state again in my system. I won't necessarily take a back seat to the Synergistic Research being berated or saying it is rolled off... I actually think it is a copper silver combo, I don't know. I didn't ask. If they didn't work extremely well - I wouldn't keep them in my system either. As you would say, it is not fair to blame poor electricity and digital glare if there is none. In my experience, in my system, it was the silver cables that caused the sonic problems.

Again my point was system matching is a factor. If you have the ability to "borrow" 3 or 4 manufacturers cables form a company such as the Cable Company I encourage you to along with the Poiema's! Listen for yourself, in your system.

Neither the Ridge Street Audio Poiema's or the Synergistic Research Resolution Reference X2 are inexspensive. With the amount it cost me to biwire, and run two pair of interconnect would equal in most cases the cost of a component. The sonic differences between the two were not subtle, and were substantial. I don't have a money tree in my back yard, and I assume most others work hard to earn their money as well as permission from the wife... so when you are at the point to drop that amount of money on cabling I would suggest trying a few different cables in that price range and make an educated decision for yourself, in your system. There can be major sonic differences.

Happy listening!

I'm kind of at a loss as to how to contribute here because at least the last 4 posts have needlessly gone off topic. If it had stayed on topic, I probably wouldn't be posting but this thread appears to have gone wrong and so now, hopefully, this post will keep it from degrading any further. If this forum were different and I were a moderator, I would either move the last 4 posts to a different venue or say "Start a new thread if you want to continue this part of the discussion.".

Hopefully for benefit, here are my thoughts on this that hopefully will be a conclusion to the last 4 posts. I'm stating my opinion and this is not an invitation to debate.

Is the Cable company a valid resource? Certainly, for some folks in many situations. Was Audiofankj's experience with out cables a noise issue? I don't think so. Was the performance with the Poiema!s in that system a synergy issue. I don't think so. What was the issue? I don't know with any certainty.

It's water under the bridge now and I'm not going to go on a witch hunt to figure it out but I do have some possible ideas. After doing a bit of research, It wasn't an "impedance or capacitance" issue I'm sure. I'm also certain that, because our cabling is very proficient at telling you what's in the recording and what the gear is doing with the recording, that the cables were revealing a deficiency somewhere in the system. Audiofrankj acknowledged this and to his credit, is more than most people would do. All systems have deficiencies to one degree or another. The selection and application of cabling falls into one of two camps; predominately neutral or predominately tuning devices. We've chosen the former camp. With that, our cables will allow a high performance, well assembled system to portray a musically satisfying experience that is excellent (in spite of the deficiencies), not perfect. Perfection is unattainable. On the other hand, our cables can also reveal how painfully obvious perfection isn't available. With the "tuning" camp, cabling will help provide a musically satisfying experience but, in my view, introduce further compromise away from excellence when the system is viewed as a whole. Again, in my view, one of the downsides of this approach is that it becomes much harder if not impossible to discover and address the "weak link(s)" in the system.

Specific to Audiofankj, here are some ideas I could investigate. He mentions an "out of phase" character. First time I've heard him use that descriptive. Couple of possibilities here. Maybe he has his listening chair positioned so he faces the wall and his back faces the system. Maybe he sits in a manner that puts him upside down with his legs resting on the chair's backrest. Maybe he uses mirrors for room treatment. These possibilities are certainly opposite of what is normal but, knowing Audiofrankj, I'm thinking "NOT!". What is more conceivable is that one or more of the drivers in the speaker system is reversed polarity. Some designers do this to meet other design criteria. It could be that through the course of the signal getting to the loudspeakers, the polarity is inverted somewhere in the electronics...not uncommon. Some people are sensitive to this while others aren't. Knowing how obsessive Audiofrankj is (LOL!), I wouldn't be surprised if he is. I don't know if this was the issue. I do know our cabling will reveal a reversed polarity system and I know that with lesser cabling, it's significantly harder to discern. I know also that a system polarity issue can be the difference between very (or not) good hi-fi vs. the "Real" or the "You Are There"(YAT or YID if you're more comfortable with "You Is 'Der") illusion. Beyond that, I don't know and can only say that you win some and you lose some. Fortunately, for us, we win 93% of the time.

So, now, maybe this can rest. I can't speak for Hassel but if this thread had been my initiation with the same question, I would have shook my head and pretty much ignored the last 4 posts.

Sincerely and kind regards,
Robert

Let me respond to Robert with what I hope is an "on topic" post:)A few months ago I decided (before I had heard of RSA)that my Krell KMA 160s/Wilson Watt-Puppy 3/2's were too "harsh" for my ears and I started looking for a new Amp (tube) (Separate thread in Amps). This is taking longer than I had hoped because of a dearth of dealers in Connecticut selling the tube amps that I am looking for, so in the meantime, I changed my front-end and tried various cables from The Cable Company and also RSA Poiema! balanced interconnects. I really liked the Poiema! between the Esoteric DV-50 and ML-32 pre-amp. It was my first choice (vs Syn Res Ref x2, Au 24, and various others, although I must confess that the cramped space behind my set-up made the RSA cables a breeze to install (vs the heavy PAD cables - however, I did hook up the Vensustas for a short time and still liked the RSA the most after a shorter listening period than maybe a true reviewer would give - it was enough time to savor the dynamics, depth and sparkle of the sound (not the cable, Robert!!) -just seemed more musically pleasing. So I kept the Poiema! cables. Then I did what I have wanted others to do for me - but nobody has obliged - compared Poiema! with PDA Venustas/Dominus Speaker cables. What happened, is either a reflection of what I knew before - (which I suspect) or else a function of the cables (which I doubt) :the Krell/Watt Puppy combination is too harsh, lean, almost, but not quite glaring (my wife said it was brightly harsh and left the room - she exaggerates......)with the Poiema! cables and with the Venustas was pleasing, mellow and laid-back to an acceptable - but still, to me, neither musical enough nor "warm" enough for my taste. However, I believe that the fact that the RSA cables sounded so good with a front end of gear that is probably neutral and accurate and too bright with a system that is probably too lean/ bright to start with,is affirmation of what Robert is saying. Poiema! cables are in my opinion extremely dynamic and accurate, and, in my opinion, just showed me what I already knew......
I will put my money where my mouth (or pen) is, and keep these cables until I get my new amp, which I hope will be an Atma-sphere if I can find a used one, and will then compare it to PAD Venustas again. If they are still too lean and bright, you'll see Poiema! cables for sale. But I wouldn't count on that!
For what it's worth, on my junior rig, in a small room, the Poiema! sounds glorious on a modified Jolida 502B/Totem Sig 1 set-up.
(The RSA were still "better" - in terms of tonality and range than the Au-24 in my speaker cable tests, behind Syn Res and Harm Tech Magic Woofer as well as Venustas - which is how this thread started!!)

Robert, you did real good! Congratulations. BTW, my little sister tried your MSE Gen II's between her DAC and classic NAD 7125 receiver when I set up her stereo back in October and she wanted to keep them! She said that of everything that was done to her system they made the most improvement. She wanted them for free, of course...