What's wrong with classical music on vinyl?

Dear Eldart: *** " real world where surface noise is the major sonic deficiency of LPs . " *** I have to agree with Albert : *** " However it is wrong to make such statements based on your inexperience and hold it up as truth. " ***

Eldart surface noise is not ( by any standars ) the MAJOR sonic deficiency of LPs. Maybe because your inexperience you think that, but is totally wrong.

*** " What is the separation spec for your phono pickup (at various frequencies)? " ***
Today this is not a critical issue in the sound reproduction of a LPs. BTW, we need, at least, 20 db on this spec for to have a very good sound reproduction. Almost any cartridge reach that spec: today is common to have 35 db on that spec, one of my cartridges: Allaerts MC2 Finish is over 70 db: yes, you read well: 70 db. I know that the CD wins in this spec, so what: the sound reproduction of a CD is always inferior to the LP.

*** " measured the signal to noise ratio of the LP medium. " *** *** " and say that there is no surface noise generated in your superb phono playback system. " ***

There is no dude that the CD has a greater dynamic range/signal to noise than the LP rig ( Albert the fact that you don't heard the surface noise does not mean that does not exist. Exist and is there in your audio sound reproduction system. If you think that really does not exist in your system then I can tell you that you have a problem in your system resolution. ), but these two specs can't tell any one that the CD is better than the LP.

You choose specs than can't support your statement that the CD is superior to the LP.

For the people that really know about music and really know about music reproduction at home: the CD is a inferior medium of sound reproduction and far away from the LP. One of the reasons is that the frecuency response of the CD is cut abrupt at 22.1 khz, this not only generate a high ringing on the sound reproduction but it causes that the music harmonics totally disappear, if for you this phenomenon is ok then I can understand your statements.
For me and for any music lover that phenomenon is out of argument. There are other issues, like the jitter, only 16 bits, etc....

Dear Eldart, I have some years in the analog/digital design: right now I have a phono preamp ( no, I'm not on sale and I'm not on audio business. ) that beats any phono preamp in the audio market and I have, too, a digital player that beats Emm labs, Wadia, dsc, etc.
We design those units because we can't find nothing that can satisfied the analog/digital music reproduction at home. I know every sigle advantage of the digital medium over the analog one and I know too every single advantage of the analog medium over the digital one.

I agree with Albert: you are totally wrong. I agree totally with Sirspeedy: the LP is nearest the " true ".

If I have to do a comparation I will write this: " the signal " flow " through the analog rig and only " pass " through the digital one.

Regards and enjoy the music.
Raul.

Thanks Raul, we need support for music, not specs.

With all due respect Albert, I'm not sure that certain specs are misleading or that they should be waived altogether... (the latter being NOT what you're suggesting, I know).
Some measurements/ specs of interest made by an Australian testing audio media can be found here. These reflect what many people try to describe -- but cannot rationalise upon...
Speaking of the 16bit 44,1 standard, part of our problem stems from how the 22kHz ceiling affects the audible frequencies one octave below. Speaking of LP noise floor, the interesting spec is the noise to dynamic content ratio; most good analogue rigs extract a very high dynamic content rendering the noise content "sonically immaterial" -- NOT the other way round (i.e. on good analogue there is NO noise).
Speaking of ("channel", I assume?) separation at least spec-wise, quite a few cartridges spec over 60.

Finally, speaking of riaa correction, most devices out there are "well below par" IMO. I'd use the other word related to erogenous rarefaction, but it's forbidden by the powers that be:). Cheers

Rauliruegas, and Albertporter....Your suggestion that my disagreement with you regarding some aspects of LP technology stems from a lack of experience is foolish, because you have no way of knowing. I freely admit to now owning a playback system like Albert's, but if that were a prerequsite to have any opinion 99.9 percent of audiophiles, and all of the general public would be silenced. And don't give me the "it's the music" story. If that were all that was important a Bose waveradio would suffice.

Gregm...As you say, it is signal-to-noise ratio that matters, not noise level per se. This is why surface noise is not a problem with most pop music that is recorded with very ittle dynamic range. Classical is another story.

Can you offer a list of cartridges that have separation specs over about 40 dB at 1000Hz, (and less at higher frequencies).